Buying new leaf batteries

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Buying new leaf batteries

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Hi Cron van dar water,  where you able to buy a new leaf battery without
talking the leaf into the dealer and having them install it?
Steve Clunn
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Re: Buying new leaf batteries

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Hi Steve,
I have two sources of good batteries:
1. Dismantlers, taking battery from a young crashed Leaf (typical 2015)
2. Buying a car that qualified for warranty replacement, which gives
brand new battery.

I just happened to recently buy a Leaf that received a brand new 24kWh
battery in Feb 2017
Which I plan to install in a Leaf with degraded battery that someone
wants to give a new life
(the original interest fell through, but I went ahead and jumped on the
opportunity to buy a
New battery anyway)

The only way that a shade tree mechanic can replace a battery and not
mess with the Nissan
Leaf systems, is to physically swap the modules from one battery into
the other.
NOTE that the BMS wiring is mechanically compatible (plug fits socket)
but the electrical
Signal layout is totally different between early and later Leaf
batteries, so you *have to*
Swap the BS wiring on the modules to keep the wiring belonging to the
BMS in the car.
Others have tried to cut corners and ended up with letting the smoke out
of the BMS.
This would be fatal for the car, except that it is possible to remove
the memory from one
BMS (even after smoking it) and putting it onto another BMS to restore
the Leaf to operational state,
Since it checks the identity of the BMS (which is stored in the memory
chip)

There is a fellow who has reverse engineered the BMS communication
enough to claim that he can
Create a filter processor board that will sit in between the CAN bus to
the battery and intercept
The messages that would disable the Leaf if it checks the battery
identity.
But that would mean adding a computer board to a car in addition to
swapping its battery,
So that it a bit of a nasty kludge and not acceptable for a customer car
that needs to be able
To use the Nissan service, which will immediately spot the incompatible
hardware.

Hope this clarifies,
Cor.

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Steve Clunn via
EV
Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2017 7:14 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [EVDL] Buying new leaf batteries

Hi Cron van dar water,  where you able to buy a new leaf battery without
talking the leaf into the dealer and having them install it?
Steve Clunn
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Re: Buying new leaf batteries

Cruisin
Watch out for the junkie batteries from a crash test, I have customers who have brought them to me for disassembly only to find out the battery had been shorted before the test to avoid a fire, which can easily
happen in a Leaf. The Junkie says tough luck. You cannot work on the battery in the junkies yard due to insurance restraints. Just thought I would give you a heads up when buying from a junkie.
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Re: Buying new leaf batteries

fotajoye
This reminds me of a case in Law, i.e., IBM vs Fed Gov: where IBM would not sell their machines to a customer; they would only lease them for an ongoing charge per month so they could maintain complete control of the machines.  The courts ruled against IBM and required they also sell the machines; however, they never went far enough and left the control software an ongoing open question.  In the case of Nissan, they and every car maker control their cars by not making their control software available in the Public Domain.  This in effect requires that you must have only Nissan maintain your car and it precludes you servicing your own car. For that matter, no aftermarket company can service your battery because they are kept from doing so by Nissan keeping their code secret, specifically, the CANBUS code.

This question, in general has been answered in only one state, Massachusetts where the Law requires motor vehicle manufacturers to "allow vehicle owners and independent repair facilities in Massachusetts to have access to the same vehicle diagnostic and repair information made available to the manufacturers’ Massachusetts dealers and authorized repair facilities."        
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Re: Buying new leaf batteries

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
In reply to this post by Cruisin
Thanks for your warning,
Batteries that I buy are always from running cars, where the buyer could
inspect the capacity bars before closing the deal.
Once a car was "messed with" (incomplete at delivery) and was promptly
returned.
The new battery that I currently have is installed by the dealer as
warranty replacement into a privately owned car,
So I am 100% sure it is a good battery and I have already verified the
capacity as 65+ Ah (better than new).

Even if I buy modules, I always ask for the capacity measurement before
buying,
So if I would ever get shipped dead cells then I immediately claim a
refund (breach of contract).
But I have never experienced that.

BTW, batteries from a crash test should have been disposed of,
So I don't know how anyone can buy such batteries except when they
"steal" them
When they are supposed to go to the recycler and then sell the modules
or the complete battery.
Since each battery is supposed to have a Nissan sticker with inventory
number, it should be
Easy to trace where the process was breached, unless the buyer bought a
battery that had its
Information removed and he still bought the battery, even though it was
from a crash test...
Anyway - there are ways to avoid this, such as only dealing with
dismantlers that are reliable
And offer refund/return on defective materials.
Hope this clarifies,
Cor.

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Cruisin via EV
Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2017 3:25 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Buying new leaf batteries

Watch out for the junkie batteries from a crash test, I have customers
who have brought them to me for disassembly only to find out the battery
had been shorted before the test to avoid a fire, which can easily
happen in a Leaf. The Junkie says tough luck. You cannot work on the
battery in the junkies yard due to insurance restraints. Just thought I
would give you a heads up when buying from a junkie.

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Nabble.com.
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