Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
10 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

Walt Jorgensen
============================================================
EVDL,

I just joined the listserv so it won't come as a surprise that I have a
problem. I'm trying to use the various archives and faq to discover
owners who have had similar experiences.

My TEVan will not take a charge.  See it at
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/951

I had been charging and driving my ///new/ TEVan for about two weeks, and
then had a very disappointing development.

I logged usage and charging from 10-15-07. Each time the charging cycle
completed, I got a FULL+ reading on the fuel gauge.

I did a manual watering of the batteries with distilled water on Monday,
Oct 22nd. It took 16 minutes from 1:44pm to 2:15pm.

Beginning on Oct 27th, I couldn't get past a half charge. Now it won't
take any charge at all.

As you can see, I never was getting very good mileage.

Here is my activity log since Oct 22nd.

Date         Time     Odometer  Fuel Gauge, Begin Activity
10-22-07 1:44pm 15085        FULL+, started manual watering
10-22-07 2:15pm 15085        FULL+, ended watering
10-22-07 2:33pm 15085        FULL+
10-22-07 5:23pm 15085        FULL+, home to Port mtg downtown
10-22-07 7:48pm 15088        FULL on line, downtown to home

10-23-07 3:22pm 15092       0.75, home to Smith Bldg
10-23-07 5:33pm 15095       0.77, Smith Bldg to Cap Lake
10-23-07 6:30pm 15096       0.77, Cap Lake to home
10-23-07 6:57pm 15103       0.27 started charging
10-24-07 1:02am 15103       ??? charge ended (maybe earlier)
10-24-07 5:24pm 15103       FULL+, home to Morgan Stanley
10-24-07 8:19pm 15106       FULL on line, Morgan Stanley to home
10-24-07 8:31pm 15108       0.77, home
10-25-07 ??:??am 15108      ???, started charging
10-25-07 12:17pm 15108     ???, charge ended (maybe earlier)
10-26-07 6:49pm 15108       FULL+, home to Traditions
10-26-07 9:00pm 15111       FULL+, Traditions to home
10-26-07 9:15pm 15114       0.646, home
10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, started charging
10-27-07 9:30pm 15114       0.52, still charging
10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, turned charging off (I had left the
                                                    heater & fan on)
10-28-07 12:00noon 15114  0.52, started charging
10-28-07 7:00pm 15114       ???, still charging
10-28-07 7:03pm 15114       0.5, turned charging off (I had left the
                                                    radio on)
10-29-07 8:27pm 15114       0.52, started charging
10-30-07 1:15am 15114       ???, still charging, turned charging off
10-30-07 2:30pm 15114       ZERO, started charging
10-30-07 5:14pm 15114       ???, still charging
10-30-07 6:40pm 15114       ZERO, still charging, turned charging off
11-3-07 12:00noon 15114    |ZERO, The /state of charge light/, a red
battery symbol on the console, was on.  Drove out of the driveway and a
block down the street, turned the corner up a hill.  It started to
falter.  Turned around and headed back.  Died just before the crest of a
slight hill.  Turned it off, then on again and got just enough power to
make the top and coast back into the driveway.

Did something not work right with my manual watering? What should I be
looking for? Any idea what might be happening?

As I noted before, the mileage, though not good, seemed to be improving
and the operation, e.g., acceleration, was fine.

I'm dead in the garage.

Walt Jorgensen
_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Motor rated current

Dan Frederiksen-2
what does it mean for a motor spec when they say rated current is so and so?
is that a max continuous current it can handle or some comfortable value
where it cruises without any chance of thermal overload?

Dan

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

rodhower
In reply to this post by Walt Jorgensen
Walt,
I just checked out your van on the evalbum and noticed
you have a generation 1 charger that does not have the
built in GFIC and won't charge on 120VAC (they added
PFC and the capability to charge on gen2, also the
built in GFI in gen 1 tripped quite a bit so they
disabled this on the control card and put an off the
shelf GFI breaker on the control box).
Whats the serial number on the black box? (it's on
that plastic tag on the front, about 1"  by 3").
Rod
--- Walt Jorgensen <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
============================================================

> EVDL,
>
> I just joined the listserv so it won't come as a
> surprise that I have a
> problem. I'm trying to use the various archives and
> faq to discover
> owners who have had similar experiences.
>
> My TEVan will not take a charge.  See it at
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/951
>
> I had been charging and driving my ///new/ TEVan for
> about two weeks, and
> then had a very disappointing development.
>
> I logged usage and charging from 10-15-07. Each time
> the charging cycle
> completed, I got a FULL+ reading on the fuel gauge.
>
> I did a manual watering of the batteries with
> distilled water on Monday,
> Oct 22nd. It took 16 minutes from 1:44pm to 2:15pm.
>
> Beginning on Oct 27th, I couldn't get past a half
> charge. Now it won't
> take any charge at all.
>
> As you can see, I never was getting very good
> mileage.
>
> Here is my activity log since Oct 22nd.
>
> Date         Time     Odometer  Fuel Gauge, Begin
> Activity
> 10-22-07 1:44pm 15085        FULL+, started manual
> watering
> 10-22-07 2:15pm 15085        FULL+, ended watering
> 10-22-07 2:33pm 15085        FULL+
> 10-22-07 5:23pm 15085        FULL+, home to Port mtg
> downtown
> 10-22-07 7:48pm 15088        FULL on line, downtown
> to home
>
> 10-23-07 3:22pm 15092       0.75, home to Smith Bldg
> 10-23-07 5:33pm 15095       0.77, Smith Bldg to Cap
> Lake
> 10-23-07 6:30pm 15096       0.77, Cap Lake to home
> 10-23-07 6:57pm 15103       0.27 started charging
> 10-24-07 1:02am 15103       ??? charge ended (maybe
> earlier)
> 10-24-07 5:24pm 15103       FULL+, home to Morgan
> Stanley
> 10-24-07 8:19pm 15106       FULL on line, Morgan
> Stanley to home
> 10-24-07 8:31pm 15108       0.77, home
> 10-25-07 ??:??am 15108      ???, started charging
> 10-25-07 12:17pm 15108     ???, charge ended (maybe
> earlier)
> 10-26-07 6:49pm 15108       FULL+, home to
> Traditions
> 10-26-07 9:00pm 15111       FULL+, Traditions to
> home
> 10-26-07 9:15pm 15114       0.646, home
> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, started charging
> 10-27-07 9:30pm 15114       0.52, still charging
> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, turned charging
> off (I had left the
>                                                    
> heater & fan on)
> 10-28-07 12:00noon 15114  0.52, started charging
> 10-28-07 7:00pm 15114       ???, still charging
> 10-28-07 7:03pm 15114       0.5, turned charging off
> (I had left the
>                                                    
> radio on)
> 10-29-07 8:27pm 15114       0.52, started charging
> 10-30-07 1:15am 15114       ???, still charging,
> turned charging off
> 10-30-07 2:30pm 15114       ZERO, started charging
> 10-30-07 5:14pm 15114       ???, still charging
> 10-30-07 6:40pm 15114       ZERO, still charging,
> turned charging off
> 11-3-07 12:00noon 15114    |ZERO, The /state of
> charge light/, a red
> battery symbol on the console, was on.  Drove out of
> the driveway and a
> block down the street, turned the corner up a hill.
> It started to
> falter.  Turned around and headed back.  Died just
> before the crest of a
> slight hill.  Turned it off, then on again and got
> just enough power to
> make the top and coast back into the driveway.
>
> Did something not work right with my manual
> watering? What should I be
> looking for? Any idea what might be happening?
>
> As I noted before, the mileage, though not good,
> seemed to be improving
> and the operation, e.g., acceleration, was fine.
>
> I'm dead in the garage.
>
> Walt Jorgensen
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Motor rated current

Morgan LaMoore
In reply to this post by Dan Frederiksen-2
On Nov 28, 2007 1:45 AM, Dan Frederiksen <[hidden email]> wrote:
> what does it mean for a motor spec when they say rated current is so and so?
> is that a max continuous current it can handle or some comfortable value
> where it cruises without any chance of thermal overload?

It is the max continuous value. It can run at that current
indefinitely, as long as the ambient temperature isn't too high. An EV
isn't running the motor indefinitely, so you can use higher currents
than the continuous rating.

Usually, motors will also give you one hour ratings about 25% higher
than continuous and 5 minute or 10 second ratings several times
larger. Motors are thermally limited and they generate heat throughout
the motor, so they can handle very high temporary loads as long as
they have time to cool off afterwards.

-Morgan LaMoore

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

EVDL Administrator
In reply to this post by Walt Jorgensen
Did you follow Saft's instructions and run a proper charge cycle before
watering?  The procedere to be followed before watering is quite specific.  
If not carried out correctly the batteries will later overflow and will lose
electrolyte concentration.  You may have to ship them back to Saft for
service if this happens.

Saft manuals are available from the EVDL library :

http://www.evdl.org/lib/

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

(-Phil-)
In reply to this post by Walt Jorgensen
I would do a full "Reset" of the pack, take them to zero volts with an
external load, such as an electric heater, and let them sit, load connected,
overnight.  Then do a full maintenance charge.

-Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Walt Jorgensen" <[hidden email]>
To: "EVDL" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 11:29 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a
Charge


> ============================================================
> EVDL,
>
> I just joined the listserv so it won't come as a surprise that I have a
> problem. I'm trying to use the various archives and faq to discover
> owners who have had similar experiences.
>
> My TEVan will not take a charge.  See it at
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/951
>
> I had been charging and driving my ///new/ TEVan for about two weeks, and
> then had a very disappointing development.
>
> I logged usage and charging from 10-15-07. Each time the charging cycle
> completed, I got a FULL+ reading on the fuel gauge.
>
> I did a manual watering of the batteries with distilled water on Monday,
> Oct 22nd. It took 16 minutes from 1:44pm to 2:15pm.
>
> Beginning on Oct 27th, I couldn't get past a half charge. Now it won't
> take any charge at all.
>
> As you can see, I never was getting very good mileage.
>
> Here is my activity log since Oct 22nd.
>
> Date         Time     Odometer  Fuel Gauge, Begin Activity
> 10-22-07 1:44pm 15085        FULL+, started manual watering
> 10-22-07 2:15pm 15085        FULL+, ended watering
> 10-22-07 2:33pm 15085        FULL+
> 10-22-07 5:23pm 15085        FULL+, home to Port mtg downtown
> 10-22-07 7:48pm 15088        FULL on line, downtown to home
>
> 10-23-07 3:22pm 15092       0.75, home to Smith Bldg
> 10-23-07 5:33pm 15095       0.77, Smith Bldg to Cap Lake
> 10-23-07 6:30pm 15096       0.77, Cap Lake to home
> 10-23-07 6:57pm 15103       0.27 started charging
> 10-24-07 1:02am 15103       ??? charge ended (maybe earlier)
> 10-24-07 5:24pm 15103       FULL+, home to Morgan Stanley
> 10-24-07 8:19pm 15106       FULL on line, Morgan Stanley to home
> 10-24-07 8:31pm 15108       0.77, home
> 10-25-07 ??:??am 15108      ???, started charging
> 10-25-07 12:17pm 15108     ???, charge ended (maybe earlier)
> 10-26-07 6:49pm 15108       FULL+, home to Traditions
> 10-26-07 9:00pm 15111       FULL+, Traditions to home
> 10-26-07 9:15pm 15114       0.646, home
> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, started charging
> 10-27-07 9:30pm 15114       0.52, still charging
> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, turned charging off (I had left the
>                                                    heater & fan on)
> 10-28-07 12:00noon 15114  0.52, started charging
> 10-28-07 7:00pm 15114       ???, still charging
> 10-28-07 7:03pm 15114       0.5, turned charging off (I had left the
>                                                    radio on)
> 10-29-07 8:27pm 15114       0.52, started charging
> 10-30-07 1:15am 15114       ???, still charging, turned charging off
> 10-30-07 2:30pm 15114       ZERO, started charging
> 10-30-07 5:14pm 15114       ???, still charging
> 10-30-07 6:40pm 15114       ZERO, still charging, turned charging off
> 11-3-07 12:00noon 15114    |ZERO, The /state of charge light/, a red
> battery symbol on the console, was on.  Drove out of the driveway and a
> block down the street, turned the corner up a hill.  It started to
> falter.  Turned around and headed back.  Died just before the crest of a
> slight hill.  Turned it off, then on again and got just enough power to
> make the top and coast back into the driveway.
>
> Did something not work right with my manual watering? What should I be
> looking for? Any idea what might be happening?
>
> As I noted before, the mileage, though not good, seemed to be improving
> and the operation, e.g., acceleration, was fine.
>
> I'm dead in the garage.
>
> Walt Jorgensen
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking aCharge

(-Phil-)
In reply to this post by rodhower
Yes!  This sounds like something that could be causing your problem Walt.

Get an ammeter and verify if your charger is indeed actually charging!

-Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rod Hower" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 5:25 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking
aCharge


> Walt,
> I just checked out your van on the evalbum and noticed
> you have a generation 1 charger that does not have the
> built in GFIC and won't charge on 120VAC (they added
> PFC and the capability to charge on gen2, also the
> built in GFI in gen 1 tripped quite a bit so they
> disabled this on the control card and put an off the
> shelf GFI breaker on the control box).
> Whats the serial number on the black box? (it's on
> that plastic tag on the front, about 1"  by 3").
> Rod
> --- Walt Jorgensen <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>
> ============================================================
>> EVDL,
>>
>> I just joined the listserv so it won't come as a
>> surprise that I have a
>> problem. I'm trying to use the various archives and
>> faq to discover
>> owners who have had similar experiences.
>>
>> My TEVan will not take a charge.  See it at
>> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/951
>>
>> I had been charging and driving my ///new/ TEVan for
>> about two weeks, and
>> then had a very disappointing development.
>>
>> I logged usage and charging from 10-15-07. Each time
>> the charging cycle
>> completed, I got a FULL+ reading on the fuel gauge.
>>
>> I did a manual watering of the batteries with
>> distilled water on Monday,
>> Oct 22nd. It took 16 minutes from 1:44pm to 2:15pm.
>>
>> Beginning on Oct 27th, I couldn't get past a half
>> charge. Now it won't
>> take any charge at all.
>>
>> As you can see, I never was getting very good
>> mileage.
>>
>> Here is my activity log since Oct 22nd.
>>
>> Date         Time     Odometer  Fuel Gauge, Begin
>> Activity
>> 10-22-07 1:44pm 15085        FULL+, started manual
>> watering
>> 10-22-07 2:15pm 15085        FULL+, ended watering
>> 10-22-07 2:33pm 15085        FULL+
>> 10-22-07 5:23pm 15085        FULL+, home to Port mtg
>> downtown
>> 10-22-07 7:48pm 15088        FULL on line, downtown
>> to home
>>
>> 10-23-07 3:22pm 15092       0.75, home to Smith Bldg
>> 10-23-07 5:33pm 15095       0.77, Smith Bldg to Cap
>> Lake
>> 10-23-07 6:30pm 15096       0.77, Cap Lake to home
>> 10-23-07 6:57pm 15103       0.27 started charging
>> 10-24-07 1:02am 15103       ??? charge ended (maybe
>> earlier)
>> 10-24-07 5:24pm 15103       FULL+, home to Morgan
>> Stanley
>> 10-24-07 8:19pm 15106       FULL on line, Morgan
>> Stanley to home
>> 10-24-07 8:31pm 15108       0.77, home
>> 10-25-07 ??:??am 15108      ???, started charging
>> 10-25-07 12:17pm 15108     ???, charge ended (maybe
>> earlier)
>> 10-26-07 6:49pm 15108       FULL+, home to
>> Traditions
>> 10-26-07 9:00pm 15111       FULL+, Traditions to
>> home
>> 10-26-07 9:15pm 15114       0.646, home
>> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, started charging
>> 10-27-07 9:30pm 15114       0.52, still charging
>> 10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, turned charging
>> off (I had left the
>>
>> heater & fan on)
>> 10-28-07 12:00noon 15114  0.52, started charging
>> 10-28-07 7:00pm 15114       ???, still charging
>> 10-28-07 7:03pm 15114       0.5, turned charging off
>> (I had left the
>>
>> radio on)
>> 10-29-07 8:27pm 15114       0.52, started charging
>> 10-30-07 1:15am 15114       ???, still charging,
>> turned charging off
>> 10-30-07 2:30pm 15114       ZERO, started charging
>> 10-30-07 5:14pm 15114       ???, still charging
>> 10-30-07 6:40pm 15114       ZERO, still charging,
>> turned charging off
>> 11-3-07 12:00noon 15114    |ZERO, The /state of
>> charge light/, a red
>> battery symbol on the console, was on.  Drove out of
>> the driveway and a
>> block down the street, turned the corner up a hill.
>> It started to
>> falter.  Turned around and headed back.  Died just
>> before the crest of a
>> slight hill.  Turned it off, then on again and got
>> just enough power to
>> make the top and coast back into the driveway.
>>
>> Did something not work right with my manual
>> watering? What should I be
>> looking for? Any idea what might be happening?
>>
>> As I noted before, the mileage, though not good,
>> seemed to be improving
>> and the operation, e.g., acceleration, was fine.
>>
>> I'm dead in the garage.
>>
>> Walt Jorgensen
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

EVDL Administrator
In reply to this post by (-Phil-)
On 28 Nov 2007 at 20:27, (-Phil-) wrote:

> take them to zero volts with an
> external load, such as an electric heater, and let them sit, load connected,
> overnight.  Then do a full maintenance charge.
>

This may be OK with individual cells.  However, I don't recommend it for
modules (batteries).  Some cells will surely suffer reversal.  Saft nicads
can withstand reversal better than lead batteries, but it still takes some
life away from them.  

If you want to try a reconditioning cycle, read and follow the instructions
on page 20 of the Saft manual here :

http://evdl.org/docs/STM5-180tech.pdf

I think you need to first confirm that your charger is operating properly,
and that the electrolyte of your batteries hasn't been overly diluted by
improper watering.

Saft nicads are reliable and long-lived if and only if they are treated
properly.  You have scarce, hard to find batteries.  If you can replace them
at all, new ones will cost you some tens of thousands of dollars.  Don't
destroy them by random tinkering and experimenting.  Read and understand the
manual before you do ANYTHING else to or with these batteries.  

David Roden
EVDL Administrator
http://www.evdl.org/


_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

Cor van de Water
In reply to this post by Walt Jorgensen
Walt,

Where are you located?
If someone is close to you with some experience of Safts,
you could have a much quicker diagnosis than going through
all possibilities by yourself.


Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225    VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675    eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Walt Jorgensen
Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 11:29 PM
To: EVDL
Subject: [EVDL] Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking a Charge

============================================================
EVDL,

I just joined the listserv so it won't come as a surprise that I have a problem. I'm trying to use the various archives and faq to discover owners who have had similar experiences.

My TEVan will not take a charge.  See it at
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/951

I had been charging and driving my ///new/ TEVan for about two weeks, and then had a very disappointing development.

I logged usage and charging from 10-15-07. Each time the charging cycle completed, I got a FULL+ reading on the fuel gauge.

I did a manual watering of the batteries with distilled water on Monday, Oct 22nd. It took 16 minutes from 1:44pm to 2:15pm.

Beginning on Oct 27th, I couldn't get past a half charge. Now it won't take any charge at all.

As you can see, I never was getting very good mileage.

Here is my activity log since Oct 22nd.

Date         Time     Odometer  Fuel Gauge, Begin Activity
10-22-07 1:44pm 15085        FULL+, started manual watering
10-22-07 2:15pm 15085        FULL+, ended watering
10-22-07 2:33pm 15085        FULL+
10-22-07 5:23pm 15085        FULL+, home to Port mtg downtown
10-22-07 7:48pm 15088        FULL on line, downtown to home

10-23-07 3:22pm 15092       0.75, home to Smith Bldg
10-23-07 5:33pm 15095       0.77, Smith Bldg to Cap Lake
10-23-07 6:30pm 15096       0.77, Cap Lake to home
10-23-07 6:57pm 15103       0.27 started charging
10-24-07 1:02am 15103       ??? charge ended (maybe earlier)
10-24-07 5:24pm 15103       FULL+, home to Morgan Stanley
10-24-07 8:19pm 15106       FULL on line, Morgan Stanley to home
10-24-07 8:31pm 15108       0.77, home
10-25-07 ??:??am 15108      ???, started charging
10-25-07 12:17pm 15108     ???, charge ended (maybe earlier)
10-26-07 6:49pm 15108       FULL+, home to Traditions
10-26-07 9:00pm 15111       FULL+, Traditions to home
10-26-07 9:15pm 15114       0.646, home
10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, started charging
10-27-07 9:30pm 15114       0.52, still charging
10-27-07 ???       15114       ???, turned charging off (I had left the
                                                    heater & fan on)
10-28-07 12:00noon 15114  0.52, started charging
10-28-07 7:00pm 15114       ???, still charging
10-28-07 7:03pm 15114       0.5, turned charging off (I had left the
                                                    radio on)
10-29-07 8:27pm 15114       0.52, started charging
10-30-07 1:15am 15114       ???, still charging, turned charging off
10-30-07 2:30pm 15114       ZERO, started charging
10-30-07 5:14pm 15114       ???, still charging
10-30-07 6:40pm 15114       ZERO, still charging, turned charging off
11-3-07 12:00noon 15114    |ZERO, The /state of charge light/, a red
battery symbol on the console, was on.  Drove out of the driveway and a block down the street, turned the corner up a hill.  It started to falter.  Turned around and headed back.  Died just before the crest of a slight hill.  Turned it off, then on again and got just enough power to make the top and coast back into the driveway.

Did something not work right with my manual watering? What should I be looking for? Any idea what might be happening?

As I noted before, the mileage, though not good, seemed to be improving and the operation, e.g., acceleration, was fine.

I'm dead in the garage.

Walt Jorgensen
_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking aCharge

(-Phil-)
In reply to this post by EVDL Administrator
According to Saft, occasional reversal is fine, and overall, will shorten
life less than you would if you skipped the full pack reset/maint charge.  A
reasonably well balanced pack will not have too much opportunity to reverse
too many cells anyway.  The secret to a well-balanced pack is to perform
this reset once in a while!  (and fully complete your charges)

Now high-current reversal seems to be bad, but by the time you bring your
pack down with an electric heater, the currents will be so low as to allow
each cell to go gently into that good night....  =)

When I last deep-discharged my STM-5-200 pack, I checked balance at as many
points in the pack I could reach with my meter.  If I remember correctly, I
could get to about 10 blocks.  I was down to .5 volts per cell when I did
the test and they were all VERY close to each other, about 1/4 volt per
block or .05 volts per cell across the tested blocks.

I couldn't get any more points without dropping the pack, but that satisfied
me.  Also keep in mind, my pack is coming up on 20 years old!

This means I won't be reversing much if at all when I do a reset.

One of the tradeoffs about having to water my Ni-Cds, is that with all the
overcharge, the pack stays in good balance!

-Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:59 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Dead in the Garage: TEVan Batteries Still Not Taking
aCharge


> On 28 Nov 2007 at 20:27, (-Phil-) wrote:
>
>> take them to zero volts with an
>> external load, such as an electric heater, and let them sit, load
>> connected,
>> overnight.  Then do a full maintenance charge.
>>
>
> This may be OK with individual cells.  However, I don't recommend it for
> modules (batteries).  Some cells will surely suffer reversal.  Saft nicads
> can withstand reversal better than lead batteries, but it still takes some
> life away from them.
>
> If you want to try a reconditioning cycle, read and follow the
> instructions
> on page 20 of the Saft manual here :
>
> http://evdl.org/docs/STM5-180tech.pdf
>
> I think you need to first confirm that your charger is operating properly,
> and that the electrolyte of your batteries hasn't been overly diluted by
> improper watering.
>
> Saft nicads are reliable and long-lived if and only if they are treated
> properly.  You have scarce, hard to find batteries.  If you can replace
> them
> at all, new ones will cost you some tens of thousands of dollars.  Don't
> destroy them by random tinkering and experimenting.  Read and understand
> the
> manual before you do ANYTHING else to or with these batteries.
>
> David Roden
> EVDL Administrator
> http://www.evdl.org/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev