EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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https://www.autoevolution.com/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993.html#agal_1
Indian Electric Motorcycle Goes for 310 Miles Range
30 May 2018  Daniel Patrascu

[images  
https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993_1.jpg

https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/gallery/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range_1.jpg
Mankame EP-1  12 photos
]

Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not such a
difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size of the
car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can have the
desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.

Being as they are, average electric motorcycles usually have a range of a
little over 200 miles (321 km). But an Indian company which goes by the name
of Mankame begs to differ.

By using a high-density, liquid-cooled 18.4kWh battery pack, combined with
regenerative braking, the company says its bike should be more than capable
of reaching well above that modest range of current bikes.  

The motorcycle’s rear wheel is driven by a Kevlar reinforced belt drive,
connected to a 40KW motor that delivers 180 Nm at the shaft and 432 Nm at
the wheel. That should give it “quiet operation and increased torque-jerk
tolerance and eliminate any lubrication needs,” Mankame claims.

The motorcycle will be called Mankame EP-1, and it does not yet exist as a
physical model. The company behind it plans to launch a crowdfunding
Indiegogo campaign for the bike on July 1st.

"Our vision is to build the most reliable electric Sport-bike in the world
that beats petrol powered motorbikes in their own field," claim the Indians
on the Indiegogo page.

There will be at least three versions of the bike offered. The one providing
for the biggest range and a top speed of 156 mph (251 km/h) would be priced
at $13,000.

Two cheaper versions would also be on the table: a $10,500, 14.97 kWh with
111 mph (180 km/h) and the entry-level $8,500 bike equipped with a 12.16 kWh
battery and a top speed of only 74 mph (120 km/h).

Neither of the three can at the time be ordered, as Mankame awaits the
official start of the crowdfunding campaign.
[© autoevolution.com]


https://www.autoevolution.com/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993.html
Indian Electric Motorcycle Goes for 310 Miles Range
30 May 2018  Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is
not such a difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The
size of the car allows for …
https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news-pictures-600x/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993-7.jpg


+
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/why-electric-motorcycles-shouldn-e2-80-99t-be-compared-to-electric-cars/ar-AAy1zC7
Why Electric Motorcycles Shouldn’t Be Compared To Electric Cars
Why Zero isn’t the “Tesla of Motorcycles” and why the media needs to stop
comparing electric apples to electric oranges. With an ever-growing number
of …
https://img-s-msnhttps://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/AAy19bO.img




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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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A small/medium motorcycle and rider generates approximately the same
drag at 60mph as a Nissan Leaf.

You're not going to get 200 miles of range from a smaller battery at
realistic speeds.

On 4 June 2018 at 19:52, brucedp5 via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> https://www.autoevolution.com/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993.html#agal_1
> Indian Electric Motorcycle Goes for 310 Miles Range
> 30 May 2018  Daniel Patrascu
>
> [images
> https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993_1.jpg
>
> https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news/gallery/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range_1.jpg
> Mankame EP-1  12 photos
> ]
>
> Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not such a
> difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size of the
> car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can have the
> desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.
>
> Being as they are, average electric motorcycles usually have a range of a
> little over 200 miles (321 km). But an Indian company which goes by the name
> of Mankame begs to differ.
>
> By using a high-density, liquid-cooled 18.4kWh battery pack, combined with
> regenerative braking, the company says its bike should be more than capable
> of reaching well above that modest range of current bikes.
>
> The motorcycle’s rear wheel is driven by a Kevlar reinforced belt drive,
> connected to a 40KW motor that delivers 180 Nm at the shaft and 432 Nm at
> the wheel. That should give it “quiet operation and increased torque-jerk
> tolerance and eliminate any lubrication needs,” Mankame claims.
>
> The motorcycle will be called Mankame EP-1, and it does not yet exist as a
> physical model. The company behind it plans to launch a crowdfunding
> Indiegogo campaign for the bike on July 1st.
>
> "Our vision is to build the most reliable electric Sport-bike in the world
> that beats petrol powered motorbikes in their own field," claim the Indians
> on the Indiegogo page.
>
> There will be at least three versions of the bike offered. The one providing
> for the biggest range and a top speed of 156 mph (251 km/h) would be priced
> at $13,000.
>
> Two cheaper versions would also be on the table: a $10,500, 14.97 kWh with
> 111 mph (180 km/h) and the entry-level $8,500 bike equipped with a 12.16 kWh
> battery and a top speed of only 74 mph (120 km/h).
>
> Neither of the three can at the time be ordered, as Mankame awaits the
> official start of the crowdfunding campaign.
> [© autoevolution.com]
>
>
> https://www.autoevolution.com/news/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993.html
> Indian Electric Motorcycle Goes for 310 Miles Range
> 30 May 2018  Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is
> not such a difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The
> size of the car allows for …
> https://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/news-pictures-600x/indian-electric-motorcycle-goes-for-310-miles-range-125993-7.jpg
>
>
> +
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/why-electric-motorcycles-shouldn-e2-80-99t-be-compared-to-electric-cars/ar-AAy1zC7
> Why Electric Motorcycles Shouldn’t Be Compared To Electric Cars
> Why Zero isn’t the “Tesla of Motorcycles” and why the media needs to stop
> comparing electric apples to electric oranges. With an ever-growing number
> of …
> https://img-s-msnhttps://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/AAy19bO.img
>
>
>
>
> For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
>  http://evdl.org/archive/
>
>
> {brucedp.neocities.org}
>
> --
> Sent from: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/
> _______________________________________________
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>



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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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Good luck with that. Not going to happen.

Al


> Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not such a
> difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size of the
> car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can have the
> desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.
>
>

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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Why would anyone want to ride 300 miles on a motorcycle without stopping
anyway.?
I think motorcycles are more for local travel and fun.  Not boring 300 mile
long trips.
Bob

On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 10:15 PM, Alan Arrison via EV <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Good luck with that. Not going to happen.
>
> Al
>
>
> Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not such a
>> difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size of
>> the
>> car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can have the
>> desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.
>>
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
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> /NEDRA)
>
>
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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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Alan Arrison via EV wrote:
> Good luck with that. Not going to happen.
>
>> Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not
>> such a
>> difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size
>> of the
>> car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can
>> have the
>> desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.

Well now, I wouldn't say that...

Cedric Lynch built a feet-forward electric motorcycle over 20 years ago
that could go over 300km on its 5kwh pack. Given the advances in today's
batteries over those he had back then, 500km (310 miles) is clearly
possible.

http://www.bikeweb.com/node/3254

--
The most dangerous enemy of a better solution is an existing one that
is just good enough. -- Eric S. Raymond
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Robert Bruninga via EV wrote:
> Why would anyone want to ride 300 miles on a motorcycle without stopping
> anyway?  I think motorcycles are more for local travel and fun.  Not boring 300 mile
> long trips.

I don't think people would routinely ride it 300 miles at a time. But
just like ICE cars that can go hundreds of miles without refueling,
people want the long range without recharging "just in case". It's a
comfort factor; they don't need it every day, but want it to be there
when they need it.

I live in the midwest, and routinely drive my EVs. They have a range of
about 100 miles; enough to go anywhere in my local area. But if I want
to drive to (say) the Twin Cities and back, it can easily be a 200 mile
round trip. Our Leaf can't do it. In theory, I could charge someplace in
the Minneapolis/St. Paul before heading back; but the places I go don't
have fast-charging facilities, so I'd have to stay overnight to get
enough charge to get back home.

In these circumstances, I have to take my ICE. I'd rather take my EV,
but can't until it has more range.

--
The most dangerous enemy of a better solution is an existing one that
is just good enough. -- Eric S. Raymond
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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OK, I'll rephrase it.

Why would anyone with a motorcycle (usually bought for speed,
acceleration, and fun of driving) want to carry around a 300 mile battery
*everyday,everywhere* that makes a huge bulk, weighs three times more,
slows the bike down and makes it less agile just for the very rare, "just
in case"?

-----Original Message-----
From: EV <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Lee Hart via EV
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2018 11:31 PM
Subject: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

Robert Bruninga via EV wrote:
> Why would anyone want to ride 300 miles on a motorcycle without
> stopping anyway?  I think motorcycles are more for local travel and
> fun.  Not boring 300 mile long trips.

I don't think people would routinely ride it 300 miles at a time. But just
like ICE cars that can go hundreds of miles without refueling, people want
the long range without recharging "just in case". It's a comfort factor;
they don't need it every day, but want it to be there when they need it.

I live in the midwest, and routinely drive my EVs. They have a range of
about 100 miles; enough to go anywhere in my local area. But if I want to
drive to (say) the Twin Cities and back, it can easily be a 200 mile round
trip. Our Leaf can't do it. In theory, I could charge someplace in the
Minneapolis/St. Paul before heading back; but the places I go don't have
fast-charging facilities, so I'd have to stay overnight to get enough
charge to get back home.

In these circumstances, I have to take my ICE. I'd rather take my EV, but
can't until it has more range.

--
The most dangerous enemy of a better solution is an existing one that is
just good enough. -- Eric S. Raymond
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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On 5 Jun 2018 at 8:01, Robert Bruninga via EV wrote:

> Why would anyone with a motorcycle (usually bought for speed,
> acceleration, and fun of driving) want to carry around a 300 mile battery
> *everyday,everywhere* that makes a huge bulk, weighs three times more, slows
> the bike down and makes it less agile just for the very rare, "just in case"?

I dunno, why would anyone with a 4-wheel vehicle want to carry around 2 tons
of steel body and frame, just so he can carry a load of lumber once a year?

Mostly because a relentless advertisement campaign convinces him that (1) he
needs it; and (2) he can have it for just a few dollars more a month than
"some econobox" --or so it appears, when only the loan or lease is
considered.

People in the West, especially in the US, generally buy what the automakers
find profitable and tell them to buy, not what they need.  And that isn't
just true of vehicles.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Robert Bruninga via EV wrote:
> OK, I'll rephrase it.
>
> Why would anyone with a motorcycle (usually bought for speed,
> acceleration, and fun of driving) want to carry around a 300 mile battery
> *everyday,everywhere* that makes a huge bulk, weighs three times more,
> slows the bike down and makes it less agile just for the very rare, "just
> in case"?

I'd say it's the young that buy the superfast "crotch rocket" types of
motorcycles. They won't care about range on an EV motorcycle; they just
want it fast.

But there are a substantial number of older riders. They don't care
about speed or performance; they care more about safety and comfort.
They tend to ride the big old "cruisers", and they *do* take long trips.

A neighbor of mine is an example. He and his wife are in their 60s. They
have a big old Harley. In summer weekends, they both hop on it and
cruise up to their cabin on the lake, about 100 miles north of here.
They are also members of a motorcycle club, and go cruising to various
outings (craft shows, state parks, see the fall colors, etc.)

--
A common mistake when trying to design something completely foolproof
is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -- Douglas Adams
--
Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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618 miles in a day.  1978 Honda 750CB  4 cylinder.  VA to MA in my youth.
Buddy Mills 


Sent from my phone.
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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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        Hi Al and All,           Having just went through this building a prototype Streamliner chassis to test low CG and a long wheelbase  handling which both worked out great I found out this.             Sadly I found out my legs no longer can hold it up over 1-2 red light cycles so that was switched to be a EV trike pickup.           Assuming dense battery modules with a good aero body, low rolling resistance tires, 6 Tesla modules would get you 300 miles.   I can do that in my subcar version I'm building.  Based on my past versions it'll need well under 100wthr/mile.           You might want to look at the E Tracer that is close to this range 7? yrs ago and a lot faster.                           Jerry Dycus
      From: Alan Arrison via EV <[hidden email]>
 To: [hidden email]
Cc: Alan Arrison <[hidden email]>
 Sent: Monday, June 4, 2018 10:15 PM
 Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph
   
Good luck with that. Not going to happen.

Al


> Building an electric car with a range of 310 miles (500 km) is not such a
> difficult task these days as far as batteries are concerned. The size of the
> car allows for enough cells to be fitted so that the vehicles can have the
> desired reach. Not the same can be said about electric motorcycles.
>
>

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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> You're not going to get 200 miles of range from a smaller battery at
realistic speeds.

Well, it wouldn't be the first kickstarter to make absurd claims and still
be fully funded. It's being built for India. Average speeds there are quite
slow. Roads are busy and terrible. You can get 300 miles out of 18kwh sure,
you'll just be going ~50km/h (30mph) to only drain the max 60wh/mile.

http://www.enginuitysystems.com/EVCalculator.htm


> Why would anyone want to ride 300 miles on a motorcycle without stopping
anyway.? I think motorcycles are more for local travel and fun.  Not boring
300 mile
long trips.

You answered your own question. Because people have different opinions than
you and what you think of as boring. There's a whole class of touring and
cruiser motorbikes from all manner of manufacturers that sell for tens of
thousands of dollars. So, who? All the people buying those bikes who don't
think it's boring.

List your favorite 5 things to do and I'm sure half of the rest of us could
find one where we roll our eyes and call you boring for liking that.
Different strokes for different folks.


> Cedric Lynch built a feet-forward electric motorcycle over 20 years ago
> that could go over 300km on its 5kwh pack. Given the advances in today's
> batteries over those he had back then, 500km (310 miles) is clearly
> possible.

Nope. Cedric built what looks like an electric bicycle, that probably goes
bicycle speeds (it doesn't say). Physics are what they are. No battery
improvement is going to change how much power it takes to push air out of
the way. A 5kwh pack is a 5kwh pack.

300km on a 5kwh pack is 27wh/mile (2.2hp).

In order to match his physics, at highway speed, with low-rolling-resistance
tires, and only 200kg total weight of bike+rider including batteries -
batteries are around 200wh/kg, so, that's 90kg of battery, add 90kg of adult
and you've got 20kg left over for bike frame, motor, controller, steering,
and fairings - would even then require his entire frontal area to be 1.8
square feet.

That's someone laying perfectly prone, on their back. That's 1'x1.8'. Your
feet are about 1' and your shoulders are about 1.8'. Magically hovering down
the road with no tires in the way or anything other than a man-shaped
bubble.

It's not possible at highway speeds.

More realistically, he's going to need 150-200 wh/mile, so, 60,000wh pack
which is 500lbs of battery. But they already say it will have 18kwh.


> 618 miles in a day.  1978 Honda 750CB  4 cylinder.  VA to MA in my youth.

There's a guy who's planning to ride his '85 Nighthawk 750 to Tuktoyuktuk at
the arctic circle. The Nighthawk's gas tank only holds 230km worth and it's
400 klicks between gas stations up there so he has to pack extra gas tanks.
And it's about a thousand miles of desolate gravel road.

The Nighthawk is a cafe racer, not a cruiser, it's comfortable for about 15
minutes, but that's his idea of fun.

To think this Indian company is going to build an EV motorbike that gets
double the range of a bigger gas bike is absurd.

My own '85 Nighthawk 750 EV conversion I'm about to mount maybe 12kwh max
worth of batteries into the frame (and it's a big bike), and it'll go maybe
60 miles on the highway. To fit 1.5x that much battery onto a frame, and go
5x as far at the same speed is an absurd claim. Which is probably why they
do the oldest lie in the EV book and tell you the range without telling you
at what speed.


> Based on my past versions it'll need well under 100wthr/mile.

Well that's just math. 18,000wh and 300 miles range. To meet their claims it
will need to be under 60wh/mile.

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Re: EVLN: mankamemotors.com EP-1 e-Motorcycle.in r:500km ts:251kph

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On 6 June 2018 at 01:46, MattsAwesomeStuff via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Nope. Cedric built what looks like an electric bicycle, that probably goes
> bicycle speeds (it doesn't say). Physics are what they are. No battery
> improvement is going to change how much power it takes to push air out of
> the way. A 5kwh pack is a 5kwh pack.

From Cedric's home at Potters Bar in Hertfordshire, to Honiton in
Devon (where his motor design was then built by Lemco), is roughly 170
miles.

Cedric was able to complete that journey at an average of about 45mph
on a single charge. Top speed is around 70mph.

The battery at that time was 48v of 100Ah Thundersky cells. They're
now around 10 years old and their internal resistance is now too high
for vehicle use, even though they retain much of their capacity.

Cedric has a couple of PV panels on the roof of his shed to charge
that original pack, plus a few more old cells. The stationary pack
voltage is designed so he can just connect his streamliner pack in
parallel to charge.

He harvests enough energy, pretty much year round, for his commute to
Bicester in Oxfordhire where he now works for Agility Saietta (who are
partners with AGNI, who now make Cedric's motors).


> 300km on a 5kwh pack is 27wh/mile (2.2hp).

Enough power for Cedric's machine to do 60+ mph.


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www.paulcompton.co.uk (YouTube channel)
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vectrix ev scooter

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 https://eugene.craigslist.org/mcy/d/2002-electric-vectrix/6587472796.html

it has no batteries, put in leaf cells  like the the guy on you tube.

this is a shop teacher retiring

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€5340 r:660km/410mi veloks.com e-trike: EP-1 e-Mcycle.in r:500km ...

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https://electrek.co/2018/06/08/e-bikes-are-efficient-but-nothing-beats-this-400-mile-range-electric-recumbent-trike/
E-bikes are efficient, but nothing beats this 400 mile range electric
recumbent trike
Jun. 8th 2018  E-bikes are efficient, but nothing beats this 400 mile range
electric recumbent trike .... comfortably ... uses a 3,000 W Cyclone
mid-drive motor ... electronically limited to 250 or 500 W to comply with
European laws ... The motor uses a torque sensor to apply power up to 25
km/h (15.5 mph), at which point the motor power diminishes and you must
pedal harder to reach higher speeds. In the off-road setting ... the trike
can hit speeds of 60 km/h (37 mph) ... strictly for private property use ...
VELOKS MK3 achieves such impressive range in part because of its massive
battery, custom-built by VELOKS from Panasonic battery cells. At 4 kWh ...
only 10 Wh/mi (6 Wh/km) ...
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/06/electric-recumbent-trike-header.jpg
...
https://veloks.com/product/electric-touring-trike-mk3-preorder/
VELOKS MK3




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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