Hammer Crimper

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Hammer Crimper

Walter Guinon
Is there a preferred brand of hammer crimper for attaching  copper battery terminals to 2/0 cable? The pictures on the web are not that clear but there seems to be one type with a pointed sliding part and another with a wedge shape.

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Peter VanDerWal
I think the general preference on this list is to NOT use a hammer crimper.

However, if you must, I think this one has the potential to do the best
crimp:
http://www.amazon.com/Ancor-701010-Marine-Grade-Electrical/dp/B000NHZZDW

Note: this is a HEX hammer crimper

>
> Is there a preferred brand of hammer crimper for attaching  copper battery
> terminals to 2/0 cable? The pictures on the web are not that clear but
> there
> seems to be one type with a pointed sliding part and another with a wedge
> shape.
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/Hammer-Crimper-tp16434990p16434990.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>


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Re: Hammer Crimper

Peter VanDerWal

> However, if you must, I think this one has the potential to do the best
> crimp:
> http://www.amazon.com/Ancor-701010-Marine-Grade-Electrical/dp/B000NHZZDW
>
> Note: this is a HEX hammer crimper

Disregard, on closer examination this is NOT a hex crimper.

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
A good cable terminal crimper is a hex shape.  A 6 corner die.  You can
modified a hammer clamp by welding on a segment of a heavy duty impact 6
corner socket.

A good wire terminal or battery clamp terminal is a heavy duty one that does
not have a small hole at the connection end.  This is normally use for a
solder indication.  If you terminals have a hole in it, than make sure the
heat shrink covers that hole.

It is best to make two crimps on the barrel of the wire terminal or battery
clamp barrel.  If you are using a heavy duty terminal that has a long
barrel, then you crimping dies should be 3/8 inch wide.  If you use the
short barrel terminal than the die should be 1/4 inch long.

Cut a piece of the 2/0 cable and strip some insulation from the end of the
wire.  Take it to a auto parts store size the wire to impact type of socket.
The wire should just insert nicely into the socket, not tight with the wire
strands only touching the 6 points in the socket.  This will be the correct
size to make you die.

Now cut a segment off the die, so you have either a finish 1/4 or 3/8 inch
wide die.  Normally I cut it about 1/32 of a inch wider, so I can dress up
and smooth the cut sides with a file.

Cut the segment in two parts where you have two 3 corner shapes in each
segment. You now weld or have it welded to the impact points on the hammer
crimper.

You do your first crimp on the terminal barrel about 1/8 inch from the wire
entry end.  Then do the next crimp about 1/8 inch from the first crimp.  The
reason why it best to crimp this way, is that the spade end or the ring end
is taper down, and sometimes if you crimp this end first, it may push the
cable back out of the barrel.

If the barrel is really long, which we may use in some industrial
applications, there may be three guild line segments for make three crimps,
first crimp the center, then the wire entry section and than the spade or
ring end section last.

A good terminal will have guild lines to show where you place the dies of
the crimper.

If you are making battery links, be sure you slide on a heavy duty heat
shrink that has a sealant in it first, because you may not get it over the
battery post clamps.

Roland








----- Original Message -----
From: "wguinon" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 7:35 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper


>
> Is there a preferred brand of hammer crimper for attaching  copper battery
> terminals to 2/0 cable? The pictures on the web are not that clear but
> there
> seems to be one type with a pointed sliding part and another with a wedge
> shape.
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/Hammer-Crimper-tp16434990p16434990.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Cory Cross-2
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
wguinon wrote:
> Is there a preferred brand of hammer crimper for attaching  copper battery
> terminals to 2/0 cable? The pictures on the web are not that clear but there
> seems to be one type with a pointed sliding part and another with a wedge
> shape.
>
>
>  
The best deal I've seen is renting the ratcheting crimper from evsource:

http://evsource.com/tls_cabling_tools.php

but you can buy the hammer crimper on that page if you really want to go
that route.

Cory Cross

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Adventure in License & insurance

Mark Ward-3
In reply to this post by Peter VanDerWal

I apologize for the long post but I have been through an ordeal for sure.
Nothing has been easy about the project.

Today I got the license plates for the car.  It went in confident that I had
all my paperwork right and figured I would hand them about $25 or so and be
out.

It is April fools day and I was the fool not to expect that Missouri as
usual is behind the times.  At the political patronage operated license
bureau, the clerk asked "where did you get an electric Saab?  I have never
heard of one"  (she is not alone in that regard).   I explained to her about
the car and even gave her the business card I made up for it and she and the
other clerks were very intrigued.  I was expecting a few more questions then
the request for my payment, since she had already looked at my safety
inspection, title, etc.  About that time a big blue message popped up on the
screen and I knew things were going to get dicey.  She read the message
"Alternative fuel vehicle Decal required"...."Uh Oh..what is that going to
cost me?", I asked.   The good news was the plate was "only" $22.50.  Then
came the bad news.  "$78" was the answer.  It seems the Missouri rather than
encouraging alternative fuel vehicles has decided to persecute those of us
who have gone to the trouble of converting a car.  In fact nobody at the
office (and it is a large one) but one clerk could remember but one other
electric car in the last decade.  It took a long time to fill out the
special forms and I got sticker number 000125.   I had to pay a total of
$102.50 with fees to get my plates which are good for one year and the
decal. Also because my car is an odd model year I can't get a two year plate
until next year, so Iwill be back again.  A stupid rule for sure!

You know the old saying..."but wait there's more!"   It seems that these
stickers come due on January 1st of each year and are not pro-rated, so I am
out 3 months (partly due to my foot dragging) and will have to replace this
unfair tax symbol next January or face a big fine if I get caught driving
the car by the MO Highway patrol.  I seriously doubt if any municipal cops
would even know what it is.  I understand paying for the plates which cost
about the same as when it had the ICE in place, but since I am not using
precious gasoline, I am to be penalized.  I suppose on the good side of
things that this fee amounts to a couple of tanks of gas for a car my size,
so in the end the laugh will probably be on them anyway.  It is not like it
runs for free.  I still have to pay the electric company after all.

As usual my state is way behind in the way they treat alternative fuel
vehicles.   While some states reward you, here they penalize you here.

I did manage to get my insurance through Progressive.  They are very nice
and treated me much better than my personal agent who will lose my business
the next time the rest of my policies come up.   He fooled around over a
week asking my company (States auto) who didn't understand electric cars.
They won't insure it and he never did get me a quote.  It turns out I just
went on line and got a great rate as a good risk and Progressive has no
problem writing me the policy.  They have great customer service.  Printed
out my card and off I went.

Like the rest of you, I know I will soon be happy about my investment of
time, energy and money as I pass the gas pumps and the gas gluttons lined up
paying what is soon to be $4 a gallon to fill up.

Mark Ward
95 Saab 900SE "Saabrina"
www.saabrina.blogspot.com



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Re: Adventure in License & insurance

Bob Bath
Dear Mark,
   Congrats on your rig.  Your experience is not
unusual.  
The reason for the additional cost up front on
registration is that you will be free of state taxes
when you pay at the pump.  You're right, we should be
subsidized for doing the "right thing", but we do use
the same roads.
    As far as the insurance, thank God that
Progressive has an underwriter who will carry you.
Most insurers (check this paradox) get hosed when
tornados, flooding, and hurricanes and deaths caused
by global warming force them to shell out bux, but
then won't insure our vehicles that _DO_ something
about the situation.
   I'm hoping that you've asked for a _stated value_
policy, because a used Saab won't be worth as much as
an EV Saab when you get hit. Simply save _all_ of your
receipts, and ask for the policy by name.  Again, not
many insurers will write them for us.
   My very best congratulations to you again.
peace,
 
--- [hidden email] wrote:

>
> I apologize for the long post but I have been
> through an ordeal for sure.
> Nothing has been easy about the project.
>
> Today I got the license plates for the car.  It went
> in confident that I had
> all my paperwork right and figured I would hand them
> about $25 or so and be
> out.
>
> It is April fools day and I was the fool not to
> expect that Missouri as
> usual is behind the times.  At the political
> patronage operated license
> bureau, the clerk asked "where did you get an
> electric Saab?  I have never
> heard of one"  (she is not alone in that regard).  
> I explained to her about
> the car and even gave her the business card I made
> up for it and she and the
> other clerks were very intrigued.  I was expecting a
> few more questions then
> the request for my payment, since she had already
> looked at my safety
> inspection, title, etc.  About that time a big blue
> message popped up on the
> screen and I knew things were going to get dicey.
> She read the message
> "Alternative fuel vehicle Decal required"...."Uh
> Oh..what is that going to
> cost me?", I asked.   The good news was the plate
> was "only" $22.50.  Then
> came the bad news.  "$78" was the answer.  It seems
> the Missouri rather than
> encouraging alternative fuel vehicles has decided to
> persecute those of us
> who have gone to the trouble of converting a car.
> In fact nobody at the
> office (and it is a large one) but one clerk could
> remember but one other
> electric car in the last decade.  It took a long
> time to fill out the
> special forms and I got sticker number 000125.   I
> had to pay a total of
> $102.50 with fees to get my plates which are good
> for one year and the
> decal. Also because my car is an odd model year I
> can't get a two year plate
> until next year, so Iwill be back again.  A stupid
> rule for sure!
>
> You know the old saying..."but wait there's more!"  
> It seems that these
> stickers come due on January 1st of each year and
> are not pro-rated, so I am
> out 3 months (partly due to my foot dragging) and
> will have to replace this
> unfair tax symbol next January or face a big fine if
> I get caught driving
> the car by the MO Highway patrol.  I seriously doubt
> if any municipal cops
> would even know what it is.  I understand paying for
> the plates which cost
> about the same as when it had the ICE in place, but
> since I am not using
> precious gasoline, I am to be penalized.  I suppose
> on the good side of
> things that this fee amounts to a couple of tanks of
> gas for a car my size,
> so in the end the laugh will probably be on them
> anyway.  It is not like it
> runs for free.  I still have to pay the electric
> company after all.
>
> As usual my state is way behind in the way they
> treat alternative fuel
> vehicles.   While some states reward you, here they
> penalize you here.
>
> I did manage to get my insurance through
> Progressive.  They are very nice
> and treated me much better than my personal agent
> who will lose my business
> the next time the rest of my policies come up.   He
> fooled around over a
> week asking my company (States auto) who didn't
> understand electric cars.
> They won't insure it and he never did get me a
> quote.  It turns out I just
> went on line and got a great rate as a good risk and
> Progressive has no
> problem writing me the policy.  They have great
> customer service.  Printed
> out my card and off I went.
>
> Like the rest of you, I know I will soon be happy
> about my investment of
> time, energy and money as I pass the gas pumps and
> the gas gluttons lined up
> paying what is soon to be $4 a gallon to fill up.
>
> Mark Ward
> 95 Saab 900SE "Saabrina"
> www.saabrina.blogspot.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>


Thinking about converting a gen. 5 ('92-95) Honda Civic?  My $23 "CivicWithACord" DVD (57 mins.) shows ins and outs you'll encounter, featuring a sedan; a del Sol, and a hatchback, each running 144V/18 batteries.  It focuses on component/instrumentation/battery placement and other considerations.  For more info,   http://home.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
                          ____
                       __/__|__\__
             =D-------/   - -     \
                      'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?


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Re: Adventure in License & insurance

Frank John
In reply to this post by Mark Ward-3
Mark: it can't hurt to write your state Representative(s) and complain.  $75 extra isn't that much (and you do use the roads) but the more they hear that people want incentives the more likely they are to change something.

----- Original Message ----
From: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 1, 2008 11:03:44 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Adventure in License & insurance


As usual my state is way behind in the way they treat alternative fuel
vehicles.   While some states reward you, here they penalize you here.



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Re: Hammer Crimper

EVDL Administrator
In reply to this post by Peter VanDerWal
On 1 Apr 2008 at 13:46, Peter VanDerWal wrote:

> http://www.amazon.com/Ancor-701010-Marine-Grade-Electrical/dp/B000NHZZDW
>
> Note: this is a HEX hammer crimper

I may be mistaken, but that looks exactly like one I own, and mine does not
make hex crimps.  It just pokes down a small area in the middle of the lug.
Not very secure, but it seems to works OK for the #6 (or is it #4?) stuff in
my Elec-Trak (which is why I got it).

I wouldn't use it or recommend it for cables in a road EV.  I have a good
hammer crimper for that purpose, and it's been fine for up to 500 amps.  
Beyond that probably a lever action hex crimper would be better, if you have
the muscles to use it (I don't).

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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Re: Hammer Crimper

SteveS-5
In reply to this post by Roland Wiench
Roland Wiench wrote:
> A good cable terminal crimper is a hex shape.  A 6 corner die.  You can
> modified a hammer clamp by welding on a segment of a heavy duty impact 6
> corner socket.
>  
I have a large Burndy MY29 manual crimper (two handles about 20" long).
It makes a dimple in the terminal ,which I think is similar to the
hammer crimper. It is adjustable for different gauges. Is this not a
recommended crimper?

- SteveS

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Scott Collins
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
If not a hammer crimper, then what - a power crimper?

Solder?

I'm wondering what the challenge of soldering is?  Not
enough heat due to dissipation by the lug and thick
cable?

What do people use to solder?  Is a plumber's torch
overkill?  Is there special solder for this job?
In-core flux or separate paste?

Is it best to get pre-tinned lugs, or is a good
cleanout of the lug opening with a wire brush enough?

Any web link references would be great.

Thanks,

Scott



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Re: Hammer Crimper

Peter VanDerWal
The problem is that these are HIGH current connections.  Even low
resistance can cause local heating, this can melt the solder or the
terminal.  Solder doesn't give a low enough resistance connection.

A good crimper basically pressure welds the lug to the cable.  Done
properly this has very little resistance.

> If not a hammer crimper, then what - a power crimper?
>
> Solder?
>
> I'm wondering what the challenge of soldering is?  Not
> enough heat due to dissipation by the lug and thick
> cable?
>
> What do people use to solder?  Is a plumber's torch
> overkill?  Is there special solder for this job?
> In-core flux or separate paste?
>
> Is it best to get pre-tinned lugs, or is a good
> cleanout of the lug opening with a wire brush enough?
>
> Any web link references would be great.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>       ____________________________________________________________________________________
> You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster
> Total Access, No Cost.
> http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
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>


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Re: Hammer Crimper

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by SteveS-5
We at one time use this type of crimper, but the specifications call four a
four way crimp.  We got by using this type by turning it four times make
four 1/4 inch indentations in one location and then another four
indentations on long barrel cable terminals.

It is now required to have a quality control inspection of a ratchet crimper
with a fix torque rating.

Roland




----- Original Message -----
From: "SteveS" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2008 8:33 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper


> Roland Wiench wrote:
> > A good cable terminal crimper is a hex shape.  A 6 corner die.  You can
> > modified a hammer clamp by welding on a segment of a heavy duty impact 6
> > corner socket.
> >
> I have a large Burndy MY29 manual crimper (two handles about 20" long).
> It makes a dimple in the terminal ,which I think is similar to the
> hammer crimper. It is adjustable for different gauges. Is this not a
> recommended crimper?
>
> - SteveS
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Josh and Jenifer
What about modifing a pair of bolt cutter jaws to crimp lugs of one size,
maybe even welding the 6 point socket deal in there for a 6 point crimp?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Roland Wiench" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 12:38 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper


> We at one time use this type of crimper, but the specifications call four
> a four way crimp.  We got by using this type by turning it

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Re: Hammer Crimper

David Beard
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
What about a hydraulic crimper? Put the dies in a 20 ton press?
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Re: Hammer Crimper

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by Scott Collins
We are not allow to solder a cable or wire terminal as the prime connection.
We must first do a mechanical connection, and if the specifications call for
solder, then we solder using a rosen core solder design for electrical wire.
We have not done this for about 30 years now.

The solder is design to fill the voids to replace the air.  Solder in it
self without a mechanical connections has more resistance than a 360 degree
crimp connection.

Solder alone is not use in building electrical, as where the solder acts
like a fuse, will melt, wire will arc and you have fire, which had burn up
equipment.

A good test with a mechanical connection terminals, is when you do a run
with you EV, the terminals should not be warmer the about 10 degrees above
the ambient air temperature. If the temperature is hot, then you either have
a connection not torque to the specifications, bad terminal crimp, too small
a wire or there is too high resistance between the lead post and the
terminal surfaces or internal battery problems.

Roland


----- Original Message -----
From: "S Collins" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2008 9:15 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper


> If not a hammer crimper, then what - a power crimper?
>
> Solder?
>
> I'm wondering what the challenge of soldering is?  Not
> enough heat due to dissipation by the lug and thick
> cable?
>
> What do people use to solder?  Is a plumber's torch
> overkill?  Is there special solder for this job?
> In-core flux or separate paste?
>
> Is it best to get pre-tinned lugs, or is a good
> cleanout of the lug opening with a wire brush enough?
>
> Any web link references would be great.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster
> Total Access, No Cost.
> http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by Josh and Jenifer
That also works, but you need a ape to help you crimp the heavy duty cable
terminals.  Use the very large bolt cutters that has a double action jaw
design.  I have bent the smaller 24 inch lever arms together.

Roland


----- Original Message -----
From: "Josh Creel" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2008 10:43 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper


> What about modifing a pair of bolt cutter jaws to crimp lugs of one size,
> maybe even welding the 6 point socket deal in there for a 6 point crimp?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roland Wiench" <[hidden email]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 12:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper
>
>
> > We at one time use this type of crimper, but the specifications call
> > four
> > a four way crimp.  We got by using this type by turning it
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Re: Hammer Crimper

Ian Hooper-3
In reply to this post by Scott Collins
Shameless plug: http://zeva.com.au/store.php?product=26

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On 03/04/2008, at 11:15 AM, S Collins wrote:

> If not a hammer crimper, then what - a power crimper?
>
> Solder?
>
> I'm wondering what the challenge of soldering is?  Not
> enough heat due to dissipation by the lug and thick
> cable?
>
> What do people use to solder?  Is a plumber's torch
> overkill?  Is there special solder for this job?
> In-core flux or separate paste?
>
> Is it best to get pre-tinned lugs, or is a good
> cleanout of the lug opening with a wire brush enough?
>
> Any web link references would be great.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>      
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Re: Hammer Crimper

Mark Ward-3
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
I have used both methods, soldering and crimping.  I modified a hammer crimper by welding a base onto it and taking out the spring.  It allows you to put it in a 20 ton press and crimp in a controlled method (using a pressure dial).  This made very fine battery cables.  I use a mini-butane torch which produces enough heat for soldering and 60/40 rosin core solder for other terminals.  It made a really nice connection.  The kind of battery cable I used is for industrial machines and has a rubber that doesn't get affected much by heat unless you torch it directly.  After installing some shrink fit that is the same color as the cable, they are beautiful and work well.  I used 4/0 cable all through the system.

Mark Ward
95 Saab 900SE "Saabrina"
www.saabrina.blogspot.com

----- Original Message ----
From: Ian Hooper <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, April 3, 2008 12:17:21 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hammer Crimper

Shameless plug: http://zeva.com.au/store.php?product=26

:)

On 03/04/2008, at 11:15 AM, S Collins wrote:

> If not a hammer crimper, then what - a power crimper?
>
> Solder?
>
> I'm wondering what the challenge of soldering is?  Not
> enough heat due to dissipation by the lug and thick
> cable?
>
> What do people use to solder?  Is a plumber's torch
> overkill?  Is there special solder for this job?
> In-core flux or separate paste?
>
> Is it best to get pre-tinned lugs, or is a good
> cleanout of the lug opening with a wire brush enough?
>
> Any web link references would be great.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>      
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of  
> Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost.
> http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Re: Hammer Crimper

storm connors
In reply to this post by Walter Guinon
My hammer crimper pushes the terminal into a v shaped base. The
connector is forced into a triangular shape. It cost less than $20.
Use a heavy hammer. As you hammer the plunger you will feel when the
connection is solid. Despite the inclination to find more complicated
and expensive approaches, it would seem you can apply more force, more
easily with a hammer than with any of the other methods available. I
put some anti corrosive paste (made for copper aluminum wire
connections) on the wire in the fitting to keep later corrosion at
bay. Plain old grease or Vaseline may work as well. If you cut one of
these connections apart, they are virtually welded together by the
pressure.

On Tue, Apr 1, 2008 at 9:35 PM, wguinon <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>  Is there a preferred brand of hammer crimper for attaching  copper battery
>  terminals to 2/0 cable? The pictures on the web are not that clear but there
>  seems to be one type with a pointed sliding part and another with a wedge
>  shape.
>
>
>  --
>  View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Hammer-Crimper-tp16434990p16434990.html
>  Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  For subscription options, see
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>



--
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1059
http://stormselectric.blogspot.com/
Storm

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