Know how to tow your EV correctly

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Know how to tow your EV correctly

brucedp4

Ask for a flatbed tow-truck

http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor/
... Feb 26 2011 ...
Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to
the friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point
where it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief
executive of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles
U.S., a new electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to
be replaced. Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation
ticket?

To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If
you are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing
from the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the
motor from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look
into electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where
this nuisance won’t be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit
Connect EV are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could
be done by towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This
allows the vehicles to be shifted into a “Park” or “Neutral” setting.
The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
driven wheels from the motor.

So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or
don’t park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         © Important Media 2011]





{brucedp.150m.com}
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Cor van de Water
Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
has anything to do with EV towing at all....

There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
(I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
on the dolly without problem)
But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
expensive one to start with.

Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
usually only happens when you are already over-revving
the motor...
usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
to take this piece very seriously, even though the
general suggestion to do your research before buying and
transporting a vehicle is sound of course.

BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
and in container it can be transported by EV (train).

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
Behalf Of brucedp4
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly


Ask for a flatbed tow-truck

http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
/
... Feb 26 2011 ...
Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?

To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
driven wheels from the motor.

So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media 2011]





{brucedp.150m.com}

--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Know-how-to
-tow-your-EV-correctly-tp3331587p3331587.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.

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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Peter Gabrielsson
A PM motor would still have iron losses when not powered so it could
overheat if towed. I agree it's a somewhat clueless article though,
always tow with drive wheels off the road, problem solved.




On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:09 AM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> has anything to do with EV towing at all....
>
> There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> on the dolly without problem)
> But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> expensive one to start with.
>
> Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> the motor...
> usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
>
> BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of brucedp4
> Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
>
>
> Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
>
> http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> /
> ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
> friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
>
> To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> driven wheels from the motor.
>
> So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media 2011]
>
>
>
>
>
> {brucedp.150m.com}
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Know-how-to
> -tow-your-EV-correctly-tp3331587p3331587.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
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>



--
www.electric-lemon.com

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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

NeilBlanchard
In reply to this post by Cor van de Water
I agree that this is a red herring -- spinning an electric motor won't heat it up, and there is no oil lubrication issues like in an ICE, and if it is park, then you have to lift the drive wheel off the ground anyway...

> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues to take this piece very seriously, even though the general suggestion to do your research before buying and transporting a vehicle is sound of course.

Sincerely, Neil
http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/


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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Mike Nickerson
But, I have heard of more than one owner that towed their vehicle and found
afterwards that their transmission was in the wrong gear and the motor
over-revved, destroying the commutator.  Obviously, everyone involved with
the towing job needs to pay attention.  Out of gear, drive wheels up, or
flatbed are the safest.  Just make sure you really did the one you thought
you were doing!

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
Of Neil Blanchard
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 5:57 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

I agree that this is a red herring -- spinning an electric motor won't heat
it up, and there is no oil lubrication issues like in an ICE, and if it is
park, then you have to lift the drive wheel off the ground anyway...

> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues to take this
piece very seriously, even though the general suggestion to do your research
before buying and transporting a vehicle is sound of course.

Sincerely, Neil
http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/


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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Lee Hart
On 3/2/2011 10:13 PM, Mike Nickerson wrote:
> But, I have heard of more than one owner that towed their vehicle and found
> afterwards that their transmission was in the wrong gear and the motor
> over-revved, destroying the commutator.  Obviously, everyone involved with
> the towing job needs to pay attention.  Out of gear, drive wheels up, or
> flatbed are the safest.  Just make sure you really did the one you thought
> you were doing!

Sure; and you can also find many people that have destroyed their ICE's
engine or transmission by towing it in gear!

Though, this is happening less often since most cars are automatics that
lock the wheels in park. It would be obvious to even a complete idiot
that something was wrong if they towed it in "park".

--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Roger Heuckeroth
In reply to this post by NeilBlanchard

What would happen if you towed a PM motor in gear?  Could it over  
voltage the controller or the motor insulation?

On Mar 2, 2011, at 7:56 PM, Neil Blanchard wrote:

> I agree that this is a red herring -- spinning an electric motor  
> won't heat it up, and there is no oil lubrication issues like in an  
> ICE, and if it is park, then you have to lift the drive wheel off  
> the ground anyway...
>
>> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues to take  
>> this piece very seriously, even though the general suggestion to do  
>> your research before buying and transporting a vehicle is sound of  
>> course.
>
> Sincerely, Neil
> http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
>




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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Lee Hart
Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
> What would happen if you towed a PM motor in gear?  Could it over
> voltage the controller or the motor insulation?

On a PM motor, voltage is proportional to RPM. If the car was geared for
(say) 80 mph top speed, then the motor voltage will be just about the
pack voltage at that speed.

The only way to go overvoltage is to go overspeed. This could happen if
it was an NEV only geared to go 35 mph and some fool is towing it at 60
mph. But under normal conditions, I think it's pretty unlikely.
--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

EV professor
In reply to this post by Cor van de Water
Cor,
   You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the Dumpster
and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long with
the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend much.
for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable and
the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck up to
12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully. tie
winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you can
adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck, clip
wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3 or 4
feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain, place
in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near back of
truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first few
feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about break
even for one transport a month...
 *  Regards,
      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> has anything to do with EV towing at all....
>
> There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> on the dolly without problem)
> But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> expensive one to start with.
>
> Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> the motor...
> usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
>
> BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of brucedp4
> Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
>
>
> Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
>
> http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> /
> ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
> friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
>
> To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> driven wheels from the motor.
>
> So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media 2011]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
*  **   <[hidden email]>
     *
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Brett Davis
The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you think
you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment, and
over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet still
has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.

I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10 years
ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and bearings
are cheap.

I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new tires
on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation truck
(they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others on
many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.

YMMV.

Brett
On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Cor,
>   You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
> until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> Dumpster
> and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long with
> the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> much.
> for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable and
> the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck up
> to
> 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully. tie
> winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you can
> adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck, clip
> wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3 or 4
> feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain, place
> in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near back of
> truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
> nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first few
> feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> break
> even for one transport a month...
>  *  Regards,
>      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
>      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> >
> > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > on the dolly without problem)
> > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > expensive one to start with.
> >
> > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > the motor...
> > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> >
> > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
> > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> >
> > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> >
> > http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > /
> > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
> > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> >
> > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > driven wheels from the motor.
> >
> > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media 2011]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> *  **   <[hidden email]>
>     *
> -------------- next part --------------
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> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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>
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Matt Childress
Trailers are awesome -- they convert my 1991 Toyota Camry (30+ MPG) into
an SUV/truck that gets over 20 MPG (and is *paid for* long ago).  Of
course it doesn't tow at 65/75 mph (more like 45-55mph).

M@

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
Behalf Of Brett Davis
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2011 12:24 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you
think
you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment,
and
over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet
still
has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.

I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10
years
ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and
bearings
are cheap.

I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new
tires
on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation
truck
(they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others
on
many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.

YMMV.

Brett
On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Cor,
>   You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling
trailer
> until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> Dumpster
> and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long
with
> the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> much.
> for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable
and
> the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck
up
> to
> 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully.
tie
> winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you
can
> adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck,
clip
> wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3
or 4
> feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain,
place
> in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near
back of
> truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading,
remove
> nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first
few

> feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> break
> even for one transport a month...
>  *  Regards,
>      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
>      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> >
> > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > on the dolly without problem)
> > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > expensive one to start with.
> >
> > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > the motor...
> > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> >
> > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
> > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
On
> > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> >
> > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> >
> >
http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > /
> > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its
motor
> > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which
would
> > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular
car
> > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being
towed,
> > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to
the
> > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point
where
> > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief
executive
> > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be
replaced.
> > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> >
> > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If
you
> > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing
from
> > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the
motor
> > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where
this
> > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect
EV
> > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done
by
> > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > driven wheels from the motor.
> >
> > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your
research
> > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or
don't
> > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media
2011]

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> *  **   <[hidden email]>
>     *
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
>
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ttachment.html
>  _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
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| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Aazam Fakharian
Dear Sir/ Maa'm
Please don't send anymore email regarding any kinds of battery or whatever
product you have. It has been years that I am receiving these emails for you. I
put them in spam and I still recieve them. I am not interesed.
Thank you





________________________________
From: "Childress, Matthew" <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 12:22:04 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

Trailers are awesome -- they convert my 1991 Toyota Camry (30+ MPG) into
an SUV/truck that gets over 20 MPG (and is *paid for* long ago).  Of
course it doesn't tow at 65/75 mph (more like 45-55mph).

M@

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
Behalf Of Brett Davis
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2011 12:24 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you
think
you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment,
and
over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet
still
has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.

I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10
years
ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and
bearings
are cheap.

I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new
tires
on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation
truck
(they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others
on
many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.

YMMV.

Brett
On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Cor,
>  You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling
trailer
> until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> Dumpster
> and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long
with
> the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> much.
> for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable
and
> the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck
up
> to
> 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully.
tie
> winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you
can
> adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck,
clip
> wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3
or 4
> feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain,
place
> in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near
back of
> truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading,
remove
> nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first
few

> feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> break
> even for one transport a month...
>  *  Regards,
>      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
>      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> >
> > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > on the dolly without problem)
> > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > expensive one to start with.
> >
> > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > the motor...
> > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> >
> > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water    IM: [hidden email]
> > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
On
> > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> >
> > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> >
> >
http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > /
> > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its
motor
> > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which
would
> > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular
car
> > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being
towed,
> > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to
the
> > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point
where
> > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief
executive
> > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be
replaced.
> > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> >
> > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If
you
> > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing
from
> > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the
motor
> > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where
this
> > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect
EV
> > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done
by
> > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > driven wheels from the motor.
> >
> > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your
research
> > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or
don't
> > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor        (c) Important Media
2011]

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> *  **  <[hidden email]>
>    *
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
>
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ttachment.html
>  _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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>
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| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Open this post in threaded view
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Aazam Fakharian
In reply to this post by Brett Davis
Dear Sir/ Maa'm
Please don't send anymore email regarding any kinds of battery or whatever
product you have. It has been years that I am receiving these emails for you. I
put them in spam and I still recieve them. I am not interesed.
Thank you





________________________________
From: Brett Davis <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 10:24:28 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you think
you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment, and
over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet still
has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.

I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10 years
ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and bearings
are cheap.

I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new tires
on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation truck
(they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others on
many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.

YMMV.

Brett
On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Cor,
>  You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
> until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> Dumpster
> and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long with
> the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> much.
> for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable and
> the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck up
> to
> 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully. tie
> winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you can
> adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck, clip
> wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3 or 4
> feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain, place
> in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near back of
> truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
> nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first few
> feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> break
> even for one transport a month...
>  *  Regards,
>      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
>      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> >
> > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > on the dolly without problem)
> > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > expensive one to start with.
> >
> > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > the motor...
> > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> >
> > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water    IM: [hidden email]
> > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> >
> > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> >
> > http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > /
> > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
> > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> >
> > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > driven wheels from the motor.
> >
> > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor        (c) Important Media 2011]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> *  **  <[hidden email]>
>    *
> -------------- next part --------------
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>l
>  _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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>
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Aazam Fakharian
In reply to this post by EV professor
Dear Sir/ Maa'm
Please don't send anymore email regarding any kinds of battery or whatever
product you have. It has been years that I am receiving these emails for you. I
put them in spam and I still recieve them. I am not interesed.
Thank you





________________________________
From: Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 9:12:49 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

Cor,
  You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the Dumpster
and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long with
the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend much.
for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable and
the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck up to
12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully. tie
winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you can
adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck, clip
wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3 or 4
feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain, place
in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near back of
truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first few
feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about break
even for one transport a month...
*  Regards,
      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> has anything to do with EV towing at all....
>
> There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> on the dolly without problem)
> But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> expensive one to start with.
>
> Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> the motor...
> usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
>
> BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water    IM: [hidden email]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of brucedp4
> Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
>
>
> Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
>
> http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> /
> ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to the
> friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
>
> To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> driven wheels from the motor.
>
> So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor        (c) Important Media 2011]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
*  **  <[hidden email]>
    *
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| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Zeke Yewdall
In reply to this post by Aazam Fakharian
Another person to put on my filter list to automatically delete... geeesh...

On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 4:22 PM, Aazam Fakharian <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Dear Sir/ Maa'm
> Please don't send anymore email regarding any kinds of battery or whatever
> product you have. It has been years that I am receiving these emails for
> you. I
> put them in spam and I still recieve them. I am not interesed.
> Thank you
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Brett Davis <[hidden email]>
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 10:24:28 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
>
> The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you think
> you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment, and
> over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet
> still
> has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.
>
> I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10 years
> ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
> winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
> maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and
> bearings
> are cheap.
>
> I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new tires
> on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
> fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation truck
> (they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others on
> many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.
>
> YMMV.
>
> Brett
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Cor,
> >  You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
> > until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> > Dumpster
> > and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long
> with
> > the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> > much.
> > for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable and
> > the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck up
> > to
> > 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully. tie
> > winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> > extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you
> can
> > adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck, clip
> > wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3 or
> 4
> > feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain,
> place
> > in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> > ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near back
> of
> > truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
> > nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first few
> > feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> > comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> > break
> > even for one transport a month...
> >  *  Regards,
> >      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
> >      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> >  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> > >
> > > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > > on the dolly without problem)
> > > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > > expensive one to start with.
> > >
> > > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > > the motor...
> > > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> > >
> > > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> > >
> > > Cor van de Water
> > > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > > Skype: cor_van_de_water    IM: [hidden email]
> > > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> > > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > > To: [hidden email]
> > > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> > >
> > >
> > > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> > >
> > >
> http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > > /
> > > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its motor
> > > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which would
> > > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> > > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being towed,
> > > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to
> the
> > > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point where
> > > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive
> > > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.
> > > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> > >
> > > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If you
> > > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing from
> > > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> > > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> > > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV
> > > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done by
> > > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > > driven wheels from the motor.
> > >
> > > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> > > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or don't
> > > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor        (c) Important Media 2011]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *  **  <[hidden email]>
> >    *
> > -------------- next part --------------
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> >  _______________________________________________
> > | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Brett Davis
Maybe the list mom can delete this person from the subscribers.

On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 5:37 PM, Zeke Yewdall <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Another person to put on my filter list to automatically delete...
> geeesh...
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 4:22 PM, Aazam Fakharian <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Dear Sir/ Maa'm
> > Please don't send anymore email regarding any kinds of battery or
> whatever
> > product you have. It has been years that I am receiving these emails for
> > you. I
> > put them in spam and I still recieve them. I am not interesed.
> > Thank you
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Brett Davis <[hidden email]>
> > To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
> > Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 10:24:28 AM
> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> > The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you
> think
> > you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad investment,
> and
> > over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving company...and yet
> > still
> > has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his jeep.
> >
> > I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10
> years
> > ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month in the
> > winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
> > maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and
> > bearings
> > are cheap.
> >
> > I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new
> tires
> > on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint on the
> > fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis donation truck
> > (they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to select others on
> > many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.
> >
> > YMMV.
> >
> > Brett
> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Cor,
> > >  You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling trailer
> > > until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop by the
> > > Dumpster
> > > and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12 planks 12 ft long
> > with
> > > the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the bottom so it doesn't bend
> > > much.
> > > for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable
> and
> > > the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the truck
> up
> > > to
> > > 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully.
> tie
> > > winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks, attach
> > > extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window so you
> > can
> > > adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front of truck,
> clip
> > > wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck all but last 3
> or
> > 4
> > > feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch wires, cable, chain,
> > place
> > > in back of truck with two planks under the EV .  Always push
> > > ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks" behind wheels near
> back
> > of
> > > truck and screw or nail them to floor of truck.  When unloading, remove
> > > nails or screws, install ramp planks, attach winch pull EV out first
> few
> > > feet, then lower to bottom of ramp with winch. Works great and  in
> > > comparison to maintaining and registration fee for trailer it is about
> > > break
> > > even for one transport a month...
> > >  *  Regards,
> > >      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
> > >      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> > >  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > > > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning
> > > > totally unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket
> > > > has anything to do with EV towing at all....
> > > >
> > > > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure,
> > > > then make sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the
> > > > road. Does not matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > > > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels
> > > > on the dolly without problem)
> > > > But you can also just get to know the EV a little better
> > > > so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC drive
> > > > S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up
> > > > to 72 MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket)
> > > > Other vehicles may need disconnection of driveshaft or
> > > > gearbox set to Neutral or otherwise...
> > > > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most
> > > > expensive one to start with.
> > > >
> > > > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear
> > > > and the only thing I can imagine is if your DC controller
> > > > starts feeding the EMF into the battery bank, though that
> > > > usually only happens when you are already over-revving
> > > > the motor...
> > > > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that
> > > > is typical for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > > > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues
> > > > to take this piece very seriously, even though the
> > > > general suggestion to do your research before buying and
> > > > transporting a vehicle is sound of course.
> > > >
> > > > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or
> > > > container transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance
> > > > and in container it can be transported by EV (train).
> > > >
> > > > Cor van de Water
> > > > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> > > > Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> > > > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > > > Skype: cor_van_de_water    IM: [hidden email]
> > > > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > > > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> On
> > > > Behalf Of brucedp4
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > > > To: [hidden email]
> > > > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> > > >
> > > >
> > http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-motor
> > > > /
> > > > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > > > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its
> motor
> > > > to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting, which
> would
> > > > normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while a regular car
> > > > can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train before being
> towed,
> > > > an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton, cannot. If the electric
> > > > vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the drive wheels, the motor
> > > > will continue to spin as the cooling system remains inactive. Due to
> > the
> > > > friction from the spinning, this could heat the motor to a point
> where
> > > > it may be completely ruined. According to Bryan Hansel, chief
> executive
> > > > of Kansas City-based truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new
> > > > electric motor would cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be
> replaced.
> > > > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> > > >
> > > > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If
> you
> > > > are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and towing
> from
> > > > the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to prevent the motor
> > > > from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You can also look into
> > > > electric vehicles whose manufacturers have designed models where this
> > > > nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan Leaf and Ford Transit Connect
> EV
> > > > are front-wheel-drive, which prevents any damage that could be done
> by
> > > > towing. They also are both equipped with a gear box. This allows the
> > > > vehicles to be shifted into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > > > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > > > driven wheels from the motor.
> > > >
> > > > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your research
> > > > first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you park (or
> don't
> > > > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > > > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor        (c) Important Media
> 2011]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > *  **  <[hidden email]>
> > >    *
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> > >l
> > >  _______________________________________________
> > > | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> > > | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> > > | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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> > _______________________________________________
> > | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> > | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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> > | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> > | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> > | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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Re: Know how to tow your EV correctly

Cor van de Water
In reply to this post by Brett Davis
Indeed, it depends how often you have to tow.
I have a grand total of 3 times and all of those
times I could borrow a towing vehicle (Jeep).
Two of those times were for my S10 truck which
I flat-towed, simply bolt a triangle to the bumper
and make sure the tires have good pressure and the
steering wheel is turning freely.
First time was from the previous owner to my home,
second time was to bring the still-battery-less truck
to the EV show and rally in Palo Alto and back.
I *knew* that the motor was permanently connected to
the drivetrain through the transmission which was
locked in second gear, but I also knew that the
redline of the motor is 9000 RPM, corresponding to 72 MPH
so I just stayed below 55 MPH and everything was cool.

The very first time that I borrowed the Jeep was because
I needed to pick up a BMW 325i with blown motor, so I
arranged for a U-Haul car trailer, but this required
either a full size van or truck and the Jeep Cherokee
barely qualified...
The car trailer allowed me to put the rear wheels on
the trailer, towing the car backwards with the front
wheels on the road, so even if I would have accidentally
left the transmission in gear, it would still not matter.

For that grand total of 3 times towing it was *way*
cheaper to use a rented trailer and fill the borrowed
Jeep's tank back to full as a way to say thank you.

Regards,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
Behalf Of Brett Davis
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2011 10:24 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly

The moving van is one approach, if you don't mind the hassle.  If you
think you will be in the game for a while, a trailer isn't a bad
investment, and over time, is pretty cheap.  My friend owns a moving
company...and yet still has his flatbed trailer that he uses to haul his
jeep.

I paid $1100 for a 2 year old 7'x16' 7,000lb flatbed trailer about 10
years ago, and have never looked back.  It gets used about once a month
in the winter, more often in the summer.  Registration is minimal, as is
maintenance.  Tires are really the most expensive part.  Grease and
bearings are cheap.

I recently loaned it to a guy from work, and it came back with 2 new
tires on it.  Loaned it to a neighbor, and it came back with new paint
on the fenders, and the dent repaired from the Multiple Sclerosis
donation truck (they denied it, I no longer donate).  Have loaned it to
select others on many occasions...it's a great way to gain favors.

YMMV.

Brett
On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Dennis Miles <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Cor,
>   You are right about this one. I was considering a car hauling
> trailer until I saw the price $$$ so now I rent a Rental truck, stop
> by the Dumpster and pick up a trash mattress, slide in the two 2x12
> planks 12 ft long with the two 2x4x10 wood screwed and glued to the
> bottom so it doesn't bend much.
> for ramp service, and the 12 volt winch with the 3,000 lb rated cable
> and the 35 ft. power cord with battery clips. (And a fuse!) Back the
> truck up to
> 12 feet from the EV, pull out the two planks and position carefully.
> tie winch to back of truck with short length of chain with hooks,
> attach extended cable to far end of car, roll down drivers side window

> so you can adjust steering wheel as necessary, put mattress in front
> of truck, clip wires to truck battery, use winch to move EV into truck

> all but last 3 or 4 feet, push EV in last few feet, disconnect winch
> wires, cable, chain, place in back of truck with two planks under the
> EV .  Always push ev to front of truck and put good wheel "Chocks"
> behind wheels near back of truck and screw or nail them to floor of
> truck.  When unloading, remove nails or screws, install ramp planks,
> attach winch pull EV out first few feet, then lower to bottom of ramp
> with winch. Works great and  in comparison to maintaining and
> registration fee for trailer it is about break even for one transport
> a month...
>  *  Regards,
>      Dennis Lee Miles .COM
>      [hidden email] <[hidden email]>*
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>  On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Ehhh, when I read this, I felt sorry for the author.
> > Unqualified claims which often are incorrect, mentioning totally
> > unrelated issues as if a towing violation ticket has anything to do
> > with EV towing at all....
> >
> > There is only one simple suggestion: if you are not sure, then make
> > sure that the towed drive wheels are not on the road. Does not
> > matter if it is on a dolly or another way.
> > (I have towed a BMW *backwards* with its rear drive wheels on the
> > dolly without problem) But you can also just get to know the EV a
> > little better so you know if you can tow without problem (My AC
> > drive S10 truck can be towed as fast as it can be driven, up to 72
> > MPH without problem, except maybe a speeding ticket) Other vehicles
> > may need disconnection of driveshaft or gearbox set to Neutral or
> > otherwise...
> > Of course flatbed is the safest way, but also the most expensive one

> > to start with.
> >
> > Motors heating up from turning is the first time I hear and the only

> > thing I can imagine is if your DC controller starts feeding the EMF
> > into the battery bank, though that usually only happens when you are

> > already over-revving the motor...
> > usually when the motor turns fast, its internal fan that is typical
> > for a DC motor is also cooling well...
> > So, there are too many unaddressed/wrong/unrelated issues to take
> > this piece very seriously, even though the general suggestion to do
> > your research before buying and transporting a vehicle is sound of
> > course.
> >
> > BTW, one thing they did not mention is box truck or container
> > transport of the EV if it needs to go long distance and in container

> > it can be transported by EV (train).
> >
> > Cor van de Water
> > Director HW & Systems Architecture Group Proxim Wireless Corporation

> > http://www.proxim.com
> > Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> > Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [hidden email]
> > Tel: +1 408 383 7626        VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> > Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> > On Behalf Of brucedp4
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2011 6:28 AM
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: [EVDL] Know how to tow your EV correctly
> >
> >
> > Ask for a flatbed tow-truck
> >
> > http://gas2.org/2011/02/26/towing-an-electric-car-could-damage-its-m
> > otor
> > /
> > ... Feb 26 2011 ...
> > Most electric vehicles do not have a transmission connecting its
> > motor to the driving wheels, nor does it have a neutral setting,
> > which would normally disengage the wheels from the motor. So, while
> > a regular car can be put into neutral to disable the drive-train
> > before being towed, an electric vehicle, like the Smith Newton,
> > cannot. If the electric vehicle (while turned off) is towed from the

> > drive wheels, the motor will continue to spin as the cooling system
> > remains inactive. Due to the friction from the spinning, this could
> > heat the motor to a point where it may be completely ruined.
> > According to Bryan Hansel, chief executive of Kansas City-based
> > truck maker Smith Electric Vehicles U.S., a new electric motor would
cost him about $5,000 if it needed to be replaced.

> > Who wants to spend $5,000 on top of a towing violation ticket?
> >
> > To avoid such an inconvenience, there is more than one solution. If
> > you are not going to spend the time dropping the driveshaft and
> > towing from the drive wheels, then tow from the idler wheels to
> > prevent the motor from spinning or ask for a flatbed tow-truck. You
> > can also look into electric vehicles whose manufacturers have
> > designed models where this nuisance won't be an issue. The Nissan
> > Leaf and Ford Transit Connect EV are front-wheel-drive, which
> > prevents any damage that could be done by towing. They also are both

> > equipped with a gear box. This allows the vehicles to be shifted
into a "Park" or "Neutral" setting.
> > The first locks the driven wheels, while the latter disconnects the
> > driven wheels from the motor.
> >
> > So if you are in the market for an EV, make sure you do your
> > research first. If you are already a lucky owner, watch where you
> > park (or don't
> > park) and be aware of the instructions when towing your vehicle
> > correctly. [Source: Green Car Advisor         (c) Important Media
2011]

> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> *  **   <[hidden email]>
>     *
> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was
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> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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