Lift EV racing ban

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Lift EV racing ban

Mark Hanson-2

Hi Chip etc,
 
Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's brought us the best EV technology.  The trouble maker should be booted off for writing nastygrams, that's it.
 
I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
 
best regards,
mark
www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
 
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
To: [hidden email]
Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
 
Hi John,
 
Thanks!
 
Although the track looks wet, it was dry. It's just the sticky, rubberized coating on it that makes it appear wet.
 
The bike was supposed to race 6 days before but the previous day's rain messed up the track's surface so they resurfaced it. A large amount of rain will lift the rubber coating off the track so the crew resurfaced it with a fresh coat just a couple days before Larry arrived to race. So it was a clean track when we got there. That's why it has that wet look to it. It was a superbly clean track.
 
Derek Barger of High Tech Systems in Colorado made the pack. Where the cells came from is proprietary (I don't even know). I forgot the cell count. But the pack is 355 volts, 14.2 kWs and weighs in at 250 pounds. Derek designed and made the BMS for the pack as well as assembling the cells into strings in the pack.
 
As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer because of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a moratorium on drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull. Alot of the founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the EVDL when it was formed so there was no consideration to that when the moratorium took place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't looked back. A few told me they'll never post here again.
 
Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly events and news. I figure there may be a few people here that understand that what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
 
Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may want to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
 
My two watts worth.
 
Chip
     
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| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Keep racing discussion ban on the EVDL

brucedp5
This is not the first time this topic has been posted. Too many with
short memories have forgotten as to why the ban was put in place. The
ban in no way reflects ill feelings toward EV racing nor NEDRA folk. For
the newbies, please check out nedra.com to learn more of what they are
about.


There is a perfectly good EV racing discussion area where heated racing
discussions are enjoyed on their own EV racing-focused list. Like the
'Las Vegas' ethic
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=what%20happens%20in%20Vegas%20stays%20in%20Vegas
whatever is posted on their racing list, stays on their racing list.

That is not true/the-case for the EVDL
*Remember, the EVDL has a higher than normal visibility, as it is fed to
several archives, that are fed or picked up by web search engines, plus
there are twitter, fb feeds, etc. of what is posted (so think twice
about what you post on the EVDL, it is quickly made visible worldwide).


It is quite important to remind all newbies and those that have short
memories of all the problems passionate racer arguments that clogged the
EVDL bandwidth with mean spirited, nasty reading on the EVDL.

We have several EVDL archives at our fingertips. Do not forget the total
disruption of the EVDL at more than one time in EVDL history (ex: a bad
one was around circa April and May 2011).
The following links only begin to touch on these ...

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Re-ECEDRA-NEWS-April-25-2011-World-s-Fastest-quot-Full-Size-quot-EV-Record-td3475781.html#a3476096
This thread is starting to annoy me.  Please keep it positive
and keep  your NEDRA / ECEDRA conflicts off the EVDL.
Apr 26, 2011

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/ban-ronald-tt3480229.html
 ... using the evdl as a means to voice personal problems with
others is incredibly inappropriate.
Apr 27, 2011

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Drag-racing-on-the-EVDL-td3531260.html
Sheesh, ... I'm really concerned.  I'm seeing something ugly in
the thread "Ron's red Camaro rolls." This isn't just bickering ...
May 17, 2011

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Ron-s-red-camaro-rolls-tt3527983.html#a3530288
Spare me the threats ... I know thats all you are good for.
May 17, 2011

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/OT-Let-me-show-you-the-door-RONALD-was-Re-S10-Range-td3537603.html
OT: Let me show you the door, ...
May 19, 2011

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/The-EAA-and-the-Code-of-Ethics-tt3537515.html#a3537587
Please respect the wishes of the EVDL and keep DR off this forum ...
May 19, 2011  




I am a member of the EVDL with 1 vote. As a member, I vote no, let EV
racing discussions stay on the EV racing list, and keep the EV racing
discussion ban in place on the EVDL.

That will leave plenty of EVDL bandwidth for discussions of EV QnA, DIY
conversions, EV designs, EV repairs, EV component sourcing, shared group
purchases, coordination of EV activities/EVents, and much, much more.

Since its creation when the Internet was new (even before there was such
a thing as web pages, etc.), the SJSU reflective listserve (an email
based discussion list) was up and helping people get what they needed to
build and maintain their own EVs. Lets keep it helping people do just
that.

Today, whether you build your own EV, buy a used converted or Production
EV, buy a new Production EV, or are just EV interested, the EVDL is
available for you to continue having that EV Grin
http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=Agc8MWYx0te_1ncsdzn.4libvZx4?p=EV+Grin


{brucedp.150m.com}





-
On Wed, May 16, 2012, at 10:58 AM, Mark Hanson wrote:
 ...

> Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's brought
> us the best EV technology.  The trouble maker should be booted off for
> writing nastygrams, that's it.
>  
> I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always
> look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
>  
> best regards,
> mark
> www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
-

-
> Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
> From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
 ...  

> As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer because
> of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a moratorium on
> drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull. Alot of the
> founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the EVDL when it
> was formed so there was no consideration to that when the moratorium took
> place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't looked back. A few told
> me they'll never post here again.
>  
> Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly events
> and news. I figure there may be a few people here that understand that
> what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
>  
> Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may want
> to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
>  
> My two watts worth.
>  
> Chip
-

--
http://www.fastmail.fm - One of many happy users:
  http://www.fastmail.fm/docs/quotes.html

_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

erik
In reply to this post by Mark Hanson-2
Absi-frigin-lutely!!!  If this is a forum to discuss EV topics, how
could any sane individual say that you can't talk about one important
aspect of EV'ing.

It's just NOT logical.

Any EV topic that is of general interest must be a legal topic for an EV
forum -- period.

Put the moratorium on the source of the problem -- not the symptom.

In fact, if this insane moratorium continues, please remove my name from
the list as this is a useless forum.  And, furthermore, if this
moratorium should continue, let's remove either the administrator who
suggested this moratorium in the first place or simply close down the
entire list.  It is no longer serving any useful purpose.

Yours truly,

 ~ Erik Haltrecht, P.Eng.

   KlnAir4U/e-Prius
   Toronto Hybrid Group
   EV Fest Exhibitor - Sep 9, 2012


"My Engine is OFF ... When will yours be?"


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
Date: Wed, May 16, 2012 10:58 am
To: <[hidden email]>


Hi Chip etc,
 
Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's brought
us the best EV technology. The trouble maker should be booted off for
writing nastygrams, that's it.
 
I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always
look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
 
best regards,
mark
www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
 
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
To: [hidden email]
Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
 
Hi John,
 
Thanks!
 
Although the track looks wet, it was dry. It's just the sticky,
rubberized coating on it that makes it appear wet.
 
The bike was supposed to race 6 days before but the previous day's rain
messed up the track's surface so they resurfaced it. A large amount of
rain will lift the rubber coating off the track so the crew resurfaced
it with a fresh coat just a couple days before Larry arrived to race. So
it was a clean track when we got there. That's why it has that wet look
to it. It was a superbly clean track.
 
Derek Barger of High Tech Systems in Colorado made the pack. Where the
cells came from is proprietary (I don't even know). I forgot the cell
count. But the pack is 355 volts, 14.2 kWs and weighs in at 250 pounds.
Derek designed and made the BMS for the pack as well as assembling the
cells into strings in the pack.
 
As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer because
of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a moratorium on
drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull. Alot of the
founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the EVDL when it
was formed so there was no consideration to that when the moratorium
took place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't looked back. A
few told me they'll never post here again.
 
Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly events
and news. I figure there may be a few people here that understand that
what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
 
Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may
want to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
 
My two watts worth.
 
Chip
 
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_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Rush Dougherty
While the "owners" of this list might lift the *Moratorium on drag racing discussion*, I'll bet you
Lithiums to Lead acids that the 'racers', John Wayland, Rich Rudman, Roderick Wilde, just to name a
few, would ever return...

The number of posts on this list is groaning every day, so just the sheer number takes a lot of time
each day to read.

Besides Bill Dube, Chip Gribben, Derek Barger, Mike Willmon, Dennis Berube and others are on the
list so the major EV Racing, NEDRA, Events do get reported. They also supply enough links so you'll
be able to see the action.

And if you're really interested in EV Racing, you can join the NEDRA list...

Rush Dougherty
www.TucsonEV.com



----- Original Message -----
From: <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 10:36 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban


> Absi-frigin-lutely!!!  If this is a forum to discuss EV topics, how
> could any sane individual say that you can't talk about one important
> aspect of EV'ing.
>
> It's just NOT logical.
>
> Any EV topic that is of general interest must be a legal topic for an EV
> forum -- period.
>
> Put the moratorium on the source of the problem -- not the symptom.
>
> In fact, if this insane moratorium continues, please remove my name from
> the list as this is a useless forum.  And, furthermore, if this
> moratorium should continue, let's remove either the administrator who
> suggested this moratorium in the first place or simply close down the
> entire list.  It is no longer serving any useful purpose.
>
> Yours truly,
>
> ~ Erik Haltrecht, P.Eng.
>
>   KlnAir4U/e-Prius
>   Toronto Hybrid Group
>   EV Fest Exhibitor - Sep 9, 2012
>
>
> "My Engine is OFF ... When will yours be?"
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
> From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
> Date: Wed, May 16, 2012 10:58 am
> To: <[hidden email]>
>
>
> Hi Chip etc,
>
> Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's brought
> us the best EV technology. The trouble maker should be booted off for
> writing nastygrams, that's it.
>
> I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always
> look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
>
> best regards,
> mark
> www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
> From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
> To: [hidden email]
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hi John,
>
> Thanks!
>
> Although the track looks wet, it was dry. It's just the sticky,
> rubberized coating on it that makes it appear wet.
>
> The bike was supposed to race 6 days before but the previous day's rain
> messed up the track's surface so they resurfaced it. A large amount of
> rain will lift the rubber coating off the track so the crew resurfaced
> it with a fresh coat just a couple days before Larry arrived to race. So
> it was a clean track when we got there. That's why it has that wet look
> to it. It was a superbly clean track.
>
> Derek Barger of High Tech Systems in Colorado made the pack. Where the
> cells came from is proprietary (I don't even know). I forgot the cell
> count. But the pack is 355 volts, 14.2 kWs and weighs in at 250 pounds.
> Derek designed and made the BMS for the pack as well as assembling the
> cells into strings in the pack.
>
> As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer because
> of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a moratorium on
> drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull. Alot of the
> founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the EVDL when it
> was formed so there was no consideration to that when the moratorium
> took place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't looked back. A
> few told me they'll never post here again.
>
> Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly events
> and news. I figure there may be a few people here that understand that
> what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
>
> Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may
> want to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
>
> My two watts worth.
>
> Chip
>
> -------------- next part --------------
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> URL:
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20120516/8e58f3db/attachment.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Hoegberg .
In reply to this post by erik


well..I see that Bruce and Admin also do have a point,, or 2,
and it probably make sense,

I still want to read about *some* of the results, from time to time,
 (without Wars)

And I like to read *most* about the tech behind it.   :-)
Maybe (!probably!) we find great knowledge from racing,  
..and some of that tech and knowledge probably ends up in our commuter cars after some years.

Chip / Admin: Thanx for the racing weblinks and more info!


...Maybe...?
Can we agree on using the email subject with the tag:
"RACING: Blabla Bla"
If so, then we still can have some important info feed in to the list.
And all the people who really dont want to read that kind of tread/subjects..can just auto-filter this subject out, in the email client.

-Bad idea?

/John
 

 

> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 10:36:48 -0700
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
>
> Absi-frigin-lutely!!!  If this is a forum to discuss EV topics, how
> could any sane individual say that you can't talk about one important
> aspect of EV'ing.
>
> It's just NOT logical.
>
> Any EV topic that is of general interest must be a legal topic for an EV
> forum -- period.
>
> Put the moratorium on the source of the problem -- not the symptom.
>
> In fact, if this insane moratorium continues, please remove my name from
> the list as this is a useless forum.  And, furthermore, if this
> moratorium should continue, let's remove either the administrator who
> suggested this moratorium in the first place or simply close down the
> entire list.  It is no longer serving any useful purpose.
>
> Yours truly,
>
>  ~ Erik Haltrecht, P.Eng.
>
>    KlnAir4U/e-Prius
>    Toronto Hybrid Group
>    EV Fest Exhibitor - Sep 9, 2012
>
>
> "My Engine is OFF ... When will yours be?"
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
> From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
> Date: Wed, May 16, 2012 10:58 am
> To: <[hidden email]>
>
>
> Hi Chip etc,
>  
> Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's brought
> us the best EV technology. The trouble maker should be booted off for
> writing nastygrams, that's it.
>  
> I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always
> look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
>  
> best regards,
> mark
> www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
>  
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
> From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
> To: [hidden email]
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>  
> Hi John,
>  
> Thanks!
>  
> Although the track looks wet, it was dry. It's just the sticky,
> rubberized coating on it that makes it appear wet.
>  
> The bike was supposed to race 6 days before but the previous day's rain
> messed up the track's surface so they resurfaced it. A large amount of
> rain will lift the rubber coating off the track so the crew resurfaced
> it with a fresh coat just a couple days before Larry arrived to race. So
> it was a clean track when we got there. That's why it has that wet look
> to it. It was a superbly clean track.
>  
> Derek Barger of High Tech Systems in Colorado made the pack. Where the
> cells came from is proprietary (I don't even know). I forgot the cell
> count. But the pack is 355 volts, 14.2 kWs and weighs in at 250 pounds.
> Derek designed and made the BMS for the pack as well as assembling the
> cells into strings in the pack.
>  
> As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer because
> of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a moratorium on
> drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull. Alot of the
> founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the EVDL when it
> was formed so there was no consideration to that when the moratorium
> took place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't looked back. A
> few told me they'll never post here again.
>  
> Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly events
> and news. I figure there may be a few people here that understand that
> what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
>  
> Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may
> want to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
>  
> My two watts worth.
>  
> Chip
>  
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20120516/8e58f3db/attachment.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
     
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_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Mark Grasser
I suppose I wouldn't mind racing "technical" entries but that is not what we
get. Personally, I don't miss what we were "getting".


Sincerely,
Mark Grasser
 



well..I see that Bruce and Admin also do have a point,, or 2, and it
probably make sense,

I still want to read about *some* of the results, from time to time,
(without Wars)

And I like to read *most* about the tech behind it.   :-)
Maybe (!probably!) we find great knowledge from racing, ..and some of that
tech and knowledge probably ends up in our commuter cars after some years.

Chip / Admin: Thanx for the racing weblinks and more info!


...Maybe...?
Can we agree on using the email subject with the tag:
"RACING: Blabla Bla"
If so, then we still can have some important info feed in to the list.
And all the people who really dont want to read that kind of
tread/subjects..can just auto-filter this subject out, in the email client.

-Bad idea?

/John
 

 

> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 10:36:48 -0700
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
>
> Absi-frigin-lutely!!!  If this is a forum to discuss EV topics, how
> could any sane individual say that you can't talk about one important
> aspect of EV'ing.
>
> It's just NOT logical.
>
> Any EV topic that is of general interest must be a legal topic for an
> EV forum -- period.
>
> Put the moratorium on the source of the problem -- not the symptom.
>
> In fact, if this insane moratorium continues, please remove my name
> from the list as this is a useless forum.  And, furthermore, if this
> moratorium should continue, let's remove either the administrator who
> suggested this moratorium in the first place or simply close down the
> entire list.  It is no longer serving any useful purpose.
>
> Yours truly,
>
>  ~ Erik Haltrecht, P.Eng.
>
>    KlnAir4U/e-Prius
>    Toronto Hybrid Group
>    EV Fest Exhibitor - Sep 9, 2012
>
>
> "My Engine is OFF ... When will yours be?"
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: [EVDL] Lift EV racing ban
> From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
> Date: Wed, May 16, 2012 10:58 am
> To: <[hidden email]>
>
>
> Hi Chip etc,
>  
> Yes! there should *not* be a ban on discussing EV racing that's
> brought us the best EV technology. The trouble maker should be booted
> off for writing nastygrams, that's it.
>  
> I meet a lot of fun folk's on the evdl at EV racing events and always
> look forward to these social EVents to get my EV excitement.
>  
> best regards,
> mark
> www.REEVA.info community service RE & EV's
>  
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 15:54:38 -0400
> From: Chip Gribben <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Almost 100,000 YouTube views on the Lawless 201
> To: [hidden email]
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>  
> Hi John,
>  
> Thanks!
>  
> Although the track looks wet, it was dry. It's just the sticky,
> rubberized coating on it that makes it appear wet.
>  
> The bike was supposed to race 6 days before but the previous day's
> rain messed up the track's surface so they resurfaced it. A large
> amount of rain will lift the rubber coating off the track so the crew
> resurfaced it with a fresh coat just a couple days before Larry
> arrived to race. So it was a clean track when we got there. That's why
> it has that wet look to it. It was a superbly clean track.
>  
> Derek Barger of High Tech Systems in Colorado made the pack. Where the
> cells came from is proprietary (I don't even know). I forgot the cell
> count. But the pack is 355 volts, 14.2 kWs and weighs in at 250 pounds.
> Derek designed and made the BMS for the pack as well as assembling the
> cells into strings in the pack.
>  
> As far as the "Mortal EVDL," we, drag racers, all had to suffer
> because of one trouble maker so we were booted off and there is a
> moratorium on drag racing discussion. I think it makes the EVDL dull.
> Alot of the founding members of NEDRA were the first ones to join the
> EVDL when it was formed so there was no consideration to that when the
> moratorium took place. So alot of our NEDRA guys left and haven't
> looked back. A few told me they'll never post here again.
>  
> Out of defiance over the moratorium, I post here, but it's mostly
> events and news. I figure there may be a few people here that
> understand that what goes on in racing trickles down to the user market.
>  
> Big things are going to be happening in racing in 2012. The EVDL may
> want to consider lifting the moratorium and being a part of it.
>  
> My two watts worth.
>  
> Chip
>  
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> |
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> | Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Bill Dube
In reply to this post by Hoegberg .
Let's see if this post is OK.

We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems
"F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.

We are in the testing mode still, and we have not yet completed the
full build on the battery pack, so it is just 274 volts. (We will
complete the build in the next few weeks and build up to 375 volts.)

We are "dialing in" the bike still. Today, Tracy Helmhold made a very
clean pass (before the rain and wind arrived) and the bike ran the
1/4 mile in 7.621 at 170 mph. Tracy did such a smooth job that it looked easy.

Here is a video link to the run:
http://youtu.be/BZlghp5b8iE
I especially liked how Tracy did the burn -out. Not more than I liked
the low ET, of course. ;-)

We captured data from the Zilla for this run with Steve Ciciora's
nifty "ZillaSucker" data logger box.

Bill and Eva

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| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
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Re: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

rodhower
This is the EV drag racing that should definitely be present on this list!
No banter or degrading of other members, just good news about an EV
that is making great progress with new batteries, new rider and some
really old technology DC motors with upgrades from a humble EV motor
builder that has helped many achieve records!
I say keep these updates for drag racing and leave out the banter bullshit.
Keep up the good work racers, it all 'trickles down' to the average EV builder
at some point (unlike other trickle down theories :-)


----- Original Message ----
From: Bill Dube <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wed, May 16, 2012 9:04:23 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Let's see if this post is OK.

We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems
"F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.

We are in the testing mode still, and we have not yet completed the
full build on the battery pack, so it is just 274 volts. (We will
complete the build in the next few weeks and build up to 375 volts.)

We are "dialing in" the bike still. Today, Tracy Helmhold made a very
clean pass (before the rain and wind arrived) and the bike ran the
1/4 mile in 7.621 at 170 mph. Tracy did such a smooth job that it looked easy.

Here is a video link to the run:
http://youtu.be/BZlghp5b8iE
I especially liked how Tracy did the burn -out. Not more than I liked
the low ET, of course. ;-)

We captured data from the Zilla for this run with Steve Ciciora's
nifty "ZillaSucker" data logger box.

Bill and Eva

_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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_______________________________________________
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|
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Re: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts

Chris Zach
In reply to this post by Bill Dube
On 5/16/2012 9:04 PM, Bill Dube wrote:
> Let's see if this post is OK.
>
> We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems
> "F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.

Hm. I wonder how they would work in a Robomower.

So far, the testing of the A20 cells is a serious success and a failure.
A success in that they will run the Robomower without problems, for as
long as I can stand watching it, without losing any speed or
performance. And they take up only 1/2 of the battery carrier while
providing about 2 times the capacity of the pair of 17ah (More like
10ah) lead batteries. And the whole assembly weighs 10 pounds as opposed
to 30 pounds of lead.

The problem of course is that the Robomower can't climb over a branch,
or go up anything like an incline. Apparently that weight over the
wheels is needed for traction. I sort of solved that by fitting back in
one of the lead batteries, works better but sad.

The MiniBMS 16 port board works like a charm; I'm able to sit there and
let the thing charge knowing it will shut off once the lead battery is
full. Likewise I fear no low voltage, knowing it will shut the thing
down. I *really* like it; just need to come up with a 24-12 volt converter.

Well, actually a 36 volt converter. I'm now working on extending the
pack to 12 cells, at which point I will try it on my Elec-trak. The
thought of running an E-15 with a little box of batteries having the
same effective capacity as 30 BB600's is... interesting. I wonder if I
can till with it (200+a draws)

Chris


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| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
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Re: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Rush Dougherty
In reply to this post by Bill Dube
GO Tracy! and Bill and the Team.
(nice camera work)

Rush Dougherty
www.TucsonEV.com

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <[hidden email]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 6:04 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)


> Let's see if this post is OK.
>
> We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems
> "F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.
>
> We are in the testing mode still, and we have not yet completed the
> full build on the battery pack, so it is just 274 volts. (We will
> complete the build in the next few weeks and build up to 375 volts.)
>
> We are "dialing in" the bike still. Today, Tracy Helmhold made a very
> clean pass (before the rain and wind arrived) and the bike ran the
> 1/4 mile in 7.621 at 170 mph. Tracy did such a smooth job that it looked easy.
>
> Here is a video link to the run:
> http://youtu.be/BZlghp5b8iE
> I especially liked how Tracy did the burn -out. Not more than I liked
> the low ET, of course. ;-)
>
> We captured data from the Zilla for this run with Steve Ciciora's
> nifty "ZillaSucker" data logger box.
>
> Bill and Eva
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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> | CONFIGURE: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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|
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20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

David Dymaxion
In reply to this post by Bill Dube
Holy bleep Bill, was that really 20 kW/kg? No slipping a decimal place or something? If it is really 20 kW/kg, wow... Let's put that into some perspective:

My stock V8 ice motor only is about 1 kW/kg

My buddy's racing V8 motor only is about 2 kW/kg

A top fuel dragster (the whole vehicle, around 7000 hp and 2500 lbs) is around 5 kW/kg

Let's see, suppose you did a top fuel dragster that was 1/2 of the weight in these batteries... 1250 lbs would be 11 MEGAWatts of power! That's around 15,000 hp!


Holy moly again! Bill watts the highest power you've tested out of these?

Holy guacamole, the motors in the motorcycle outweigh the battery pack!



________________________________
 From: Bill Dube <[hidden email]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 7:04 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)
 
Let's see if this post is OK.

We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems "F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.

We are in the testing mode still, and we have not yet completed the full build on the battery pack, so it is just 274 volts. (We will complete the build in the next few weeks and build up to 375 volts.)

We are "dialing in" the bike still. Today, Tracy Helmhold made a very clean pass (before the rain and wind arrived) and the bike ran the 1/4 mile in 7.621 at 170 mph. Tracy did such a smooth job that it looked easy.

Here is a video link to the run:
http://youtu.be/BZlghp5b8iE
I especially liked how Tracy did the burn -out. Not more than I liked the low ET, of course. ;-)

We captured data from the Zilla for this run with Steve Ciciora's nifty "ZillaSucker" data logger box.
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|
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Re: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts

Top EV Racing - Lists
In reply to this post by Rush Dougherty
A huge congratulations to you and your team Bill.
Amazing power density, and a very straight and controlled run.
Your machine will be a force well into the 6's !!

Sincerely,
Michael Fragomeni

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Re: 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Bill Dube
In reply to this post by David Dymaxion
At the pack level, we get about 10 HP per pound. (~16 kW/kg) Not for
a long time, but for long enough. ;-)

Each 34 gram cell puts out nearly 1 HP. Transferring one HP from such
a small cell involves some losses. The weight of the interconnects
needed to transfer 100's of amps from one cell to the next is not
insignificant compared to 34 grams. It is difficult to balance the
weight of the interconnects against the losses you suffer to make
them lighter.

Each of the motors separately weighs more than the pack.


At 10:52 PM 5/16/2012, you wrote:

>Holy bleep Bill, was that really 20 kW/kg? No slipping a decimal
>place or something? If it is really 20 kW/kg, wow... Let's put that
>into some perspective:
>
>My stock V8 ice motor only is about 1 kW/kg
>
>My buddy's racing V8 motor only is about 2 kW/kg
>
>A top fuel dragster (the whole vehicle, around 7000 hp and 2500 lbs)
>is around 5 kW/kg
>
>Let's see, suppose you did a top fuel dragster that was 1/2 of the
>weight in these batteries... 1250 lbs would be 11 MEGAWatts of
>power! That's around 15,000 hp!
>
>
>Holy moly again! Bill watts the highest power you've tested out of these?
>
>Holy guacamole, the motors in the motorcycle outweigh the battery pack!
>
>
>
>________________________________
>  From: Bill Dube <[hidden email]>
>To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[hidden email]>
>Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 7:04 PM
>Subject: [EVDL] Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)
>
>Let's see if this post is OK.
>
>We ran the KillaCycle today on our new 68 lb pack of  A123Systems
>"F1" cells. These deliver 20,000 W/kg.
>
>We are in the testing mode still, and we have not yet completed the
>full build on the battery pack, so it is just 274 volts. (We will
>complete the build in the next few weeks and build up to 375 volts.)
>
>We are "dialing in" the bike still. Today, Tracy Helmhold made a
>very clean pass (before the rain and wind arrived) and the bike ran
>the 1/4 mile in 7.621 at 170 mph. Tracy did such a smooth job that
>it looked easy.
>
>Here is a video link to the run:
>http://youtu.be/BZlghp5b8iE
>I especially liked how Tracy did the burn -out. Not more than I
>liked the low ET, of course. ;-)
>
>We captured data from the Zilla for this run with Steve Ciciora's
>nifty "ZillaSucker" data logger box.
>-------------- next part --------------
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>
>_______________________________________________
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>| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
>|
>| REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
>| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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RACING: peak power string for underzized commuter pack. Was, 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Hoegberg .

Hi Bill,  Nice!
-Aha So you go for maximum weight reduction now?  
"34grams". Cant be large cell,
I guess that weight says it it is the 18650 size? With the strange "weld-bump" in each end for laser welding it to punched holes in copper sheets?
This bump making it a "18700"-size?

-My LiFePO4"EV"-cells from peak/k2/DLG are 26650 size and 3.3Ah ("maybe" a 5C -cell and Phostech powder.)
weight was about 82grams, BUT..out of that weight it was maybe the steel-can was 18-20 grams!!
Still way over 100Wh/kg total in that cell so it is an OK low power cell.
but when I see that a big part of the weight is just cell casing..I was not so happy with the design,
A lot of material and weight is "wasted" when we make millions of cells. Stupid?


-Anyway, Interesting with the Ultra F1!  What is the voltage 20-25´C @ "20kW"?  = 1.? Volt


-I have thougt of using a string of this cells for "peak demand" and have the undersized big cheaper 1-3C cells for the "bulk" and semi-long comuter distances (28km), the large cells (40Ah) can not take full acceleration or the regen peaks without problems, so maybe the voltage zags down in the main pack, and then the "stiffer" Ultra-cells in parallel can take all that power just the few seconds needed.....? Can this be a kind of "self regulating" paralell system, as I hope? Good in very hard driving, stop&go applications,Thats my idea to try, when I can afford it... But maybe someone on the list already have done this and can tell me that it is not a good idea, and will not work for reason x,y,z ?  

Kind Regards
// John


> Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 03:38:29 -0600
> To: [hidden email]
> From: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)
>
> At the pack level, we get about 10 HP per pound. (~16 kW/kg) Not for
> a long time, but for long enough. ;-)
>
> Each 34 gram cell puts out nearly 1 HP. Transferring one HP from such
> a small cell involves some losses. The weight of the interconnects
> needed to transfer 100's of amps from one cell to the next is not
> insignificant compared to 34 grams. It is difficult to balance the
> weight of the interconnects against the losses you suffer to make
> them lighter.
>
> Each of the motors separately weighs more than the pack.
>
>
> At 10:52 PM 5/16/2012, you wrote:
> >Holy bleep Bill, was that really 20 kW/kg? No slipping a decimal
> >place or something? If it is really 20 kW/kg, wow... Let's put that
> >into some perspective:
> >
> >My stock V8 ice motor only is about 1 kW/kg
> >
> >My buddy's racing V8 motor only is about 2 kW/kg
> >
> >A top fuel dragster (the whole vehicle, around 7000 hp and 2500 lbs)
> >is around 5 kW/kg
> >
> >Let's see, suppose you did a top fuel dragster that was 1/2 of the
> >weight in these batteries... 1250 lbs would be 11 MEGAWatts of
> >power! That's around 15,000 hp!

     
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Robert MacDowell-2
In reply to this post by Mark Grasser
It's a lot easier to teach a violin player the bongoes than the other way
round.

It's a lot easier to for people who wanna hear it to subscribe to two
mailing lists... than for people who don't, to sort wheat from chaff,
resist the urge, etc.

If the issue is due to certain individual problem posters, here is one
group's solution to the moderation dilemma:
http://elitistjerks.com/f34/a54-forum_rules_updated_7_14_10/
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Nathan Loofbourrow
The Banhammer works, but requires a lot of moderator effort. The folks at diyelectriccar do not use it often, and not without warning, but it makes a huge difference. I don't blame moderators for not wanting to have to take on the added responsibility of enforcing those sorts of rules, especially if they don't have automated forum software to help.

n


On May 17, 2012, at 2:15 PM, Robert MacDowell <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It's a lot easier to teach a violin player the bongoes than the other way
> round.
>
> It's a lot easier to for people who wanna hear it to subscribe to two
> mailing lists... than for people who don't, to sort wheat from chaff,
> resist the urge, etc.
>
> If the issue is due to certain individual problem posters, here is one
> group's solution to the moderation dilemma:
> http://elitistjerks.com/f34/a54-forum_rules_updated_7_14_10/

_______________________________________________
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| Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
|
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Cor van de Water
Robert MacDowell wrote:
> http://elitistjerks.com/f34/a54-forum_rules_updated_7_14_10/

I get "You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access
this page."
Before being able to read what you quote, I would have to register to
yet another list...

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water     XoIP: +31877841130
Tel: +1 408 383 7626        Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203

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Re: RACING: peak power string for underzized commuter pack. Was, 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)

Hoegberg .
In reply to this post by Hoegberg .

The problem I have seen with LiFePO4 before was the price..as it needs a serious oversizing to be nice on a low rate energy cell, a 40km range car was not possible with the right size 1-3C cells, but maybe it is possible now to do a 40Ah 120 V pack if the a123 cost 25usd @20Ah soon. then it solves the problem, without any need for my idea below
Maybe even shorter range EVs can be made now with good batt pack economy? My setup would be 20km if so, a full power car with One single string of 20Ah a123,  (30 or 36 cells )
but that might probably be just over the limit for the a123 20Ah cells., in hard city driving all day long? if repeated..with many 100 or 300Amp charges a day.


The controller I have now is the old curtis 1221 (400Amp),
no gearbox, The motor is a Thrige titan 4.7kW 48V. now @96V 400Amps...
/John

> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 17:46:29 +0200
> Subject: [EVDL] RACING: peak power string for underzized commuter pack. Was, 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)
>
>
> Hi Bill,  Nice!
> -Aha So you go for maximum weight reduction now?  
> "34grams". Cant be large cell,
> I guess that weight says it it is the 18650 size? With the strange "weld-bump" in each end for laser welding it to punched holes in copper sheets?
> This bump making it a "18700"-size?
>
> -My LiFePO4"EV"-cells from peak/k2/DLG are 26650 size and 3.3Ah ("maybe" a 5C -cell and Phostech powder.)
> weight was about 82grams, BUT..out of that weight it was maybe the steel-can was 18-20 grams!!
> Still way over 100Wh/kg total in that cell so it is an OK low power cell.
> but when I see that a big part of the weight is just cell casing..I was not so happy with the design,
> A lot of material and weight is "wasted" when we make millions of cells. Stupid?
>
>
> -Anyway, Interesting with the Ultra F1!  What is the voltage 20-25´C @ "20kW"?  = 1.? Volt
>
>
> -I have thougt of using a string of this cells for "peak demand" and have the undersized big cheaper 1-3C cells for the "bulk" and semi-long comuter distances (28km), the large cells (40Ah) can not take full acceleration or the regen peaks without problems, so maybe the voltage zags down in the main pack, and then the "stiffer" Ultra-cells in parallel can take all that power just the few seconds needed.....? Can this be a kind of "self regulating" paralell system, as I hope? Good in very hard driving, stop&go applications,Thats my idea to try, when I can afford it... But maybe someone on the list already have done this and can tell me that it is not a good idea, and will not work for reason x,y,z ?  
>
> Kind Regards
> // John
>
>
> > Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 03:38:29 -0600
> > To: [hidden email]
> > From: [hidden email]
> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] 20 kW/kg! was: Ran a 7.621 today on just 274 volts (was: Lift EV racing ban)
> >
> > At the pack level, we get about 10 HP per pound. (~16 kW/kg) Not for
> > a long time, but for long enough. ;-)
> >
> > Each 34 gram cell puts out nearly 1 HP. Transferring one HP from such
> > a small cell involves some losses. The weight of the interconnects
> > needed to transfer 100's of amps from one cell to the next is not
> > insignificant compared to 34 grams. It is difficult to balance the
> > weight of the interconnects against the losses you suffer to make
> > them lighter.
> >
> > Each of the motors separately weighs more than the pack.
> >
> >
> > At 10:52 PM 5/16/2012, you wrote:
> > >Holy bleep Bill, was that really 20 kW/kg? No slipping a decimal
> > >place or something? If it is really 20 kW/kg, wow... Let's put that
> > >into some perspective:
> > >
> > >My stock V8 ice motor only is about 1 kW/kg
> > >
> > >My buddy's racing V8 motor only is about 2 kW/kg
> > >
> > >A top fuel dragster (the whole vehicle, around 7000 hp and 2500 lbs)
> > >is around 5 kW/kg
> > >
> > >Let's see, suppose you did a top fuel dragster that was 1/2 of the
> > >weight in these batteries... 1250 lbs would be 11 MEGAWatts of
> > >power! That's around 15,000 hp!
>
>      
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Morgan LaMoore
In reply to this post by Cor van de Water
When it was first posted, I was able to read it. I wonder if they got too
much web traffic and added restrictions...

I wouldn't recommend registering unless you're interested in in-depth World
of Warcraft analysis.

On Fri, May 18, 2012 at 2:22 PM, Cor van de Water <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Robert MacDowell wrote:
> > http://elitistjerks.com/f34/a54-forum_rules_updated_7_14_10/
>
> I get "You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access
> this page."
> Before being able to read what you quote, I would have to register to
> yet another list...
>
> Cor van de Water
> Chief Scientist
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [hidden email]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water     XoIP: +31877841130
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626        Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203
>
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere.  Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [hidden email] only.
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> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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Re: Lift EV racing ban

Mike Scott-13
In reply to this post by Hoegberg .
Well, not a bad idea, but not one that works in the so called "Web Mail"
clients a lot of us are stuck with. I'm still having to manually mark each
and every one of the posts that are specially marked EVLN, because they
still contain the EVDL marker. Same thing would happen with a RACING
marker...

If the post somewhat above yours is any indication of the type we will be
seeing more of, I'm out.

On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Hoegberg . <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> ...
> ...Maybe...?
> Can we agree on using the email subject with the tag:
> "RACING: Blabla Bla"
> If so, then we still can have some important info feed in to the list.
> And all the people who really dont want to read that kind of
> tread/subjects..can just auto-filter this subject out, in the email client.
>
> -Bad idea?
>
> /John
>
>
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