Overheating Zilla?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
9 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Overheating Zilla?

TiM M-3
It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20 mile run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling about 200 amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted into a convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best I could. I couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every time I try (once a year or so) I have the same problem and can't remember what it was I needed to do to get it to work... It's hell getting old, I hear your memory is the second thing to go, I forgot what the first thing was. Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten minutes with the water pump running and I drove it on home. I checked the temps when I got there, the water temp was ~125, the batteries were a little over 100. The Zilla case was showing 125-130. All temps from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway, I thought the Zilla throttled back before it cut out due to over temping... I went from fine to dead in a
 split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10 minutes of sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road again...
Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm pumping my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto the tranny cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks,

TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside

PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in Ventura, California at the fairgrounds.


     

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Mark Eidson
If the heat sink gets to 212F I believe the unit shuts down.....It was
112F ambient outside on my drive home yesterday and the check engine
light was flashing most of the way home and for some time after I
stopped indicating that the controller was cutting back.  I could feel
a loss of performance but it never shut down.....Was your check engine
light flashing?  The unit starts cutting back at a heat sink temp of
50C/122F.  The cruise current on my bike is about 120A I guess I did
not get to the 100C cutoff temp......me

On 6/18/08, TiM M <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20 mile run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling about 200 amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted into a convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best I could. I couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every time I try (once a year or so) I have the same problem and can't remember what it was I needed to do to get it to work... It's hell getting old, I hear your memory is the second thing to go, I forgot what the first thing was. Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten minutes with the water pump running and I drove it on home. I checked the temps when I got there, the water temp was ~125, the batteries were a little over 100. The Zilla case was showing 125-130. All temps from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway, I thought the Zilla throttled back before it cut out due to over temping... I went from fine to dead in a
>  split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10 minutes of sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road again...
> Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm pumping my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto the tranny cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside
>
> PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in Ventura, California at the fairgrounds.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by TiM M-3
Hello Tim,

My first start up with a new Zilla, I could not get the palm to come up.
Otmar said you do not have to have the ignition circuit on.  He said put a
separate switch for the 12 volt power that is on all the time.  First
connect up the palm unit, then turn the 12 volt on and off.  So that's what
I did, and I got the menu on the palm unit.  Otmar said, some of these units
required this operation.

It is best to water cool the Zilla using a holding tank.  I use a Pontiac
expansion tank where the water level is just a bit higher than the Zilla.  A
Maxi-Jet 1200 pump plugs right into the bottom of this tank and than a 3/8
lines go down to the bottom front of the vehicle, through a transmission or
oil cooler that has 3/8 exit lines that go up to the Zilla.  A 3/8 line goes
to the top of the tank.

In the summer, I had 140 F. degree temperature under the top of a dark blue
hood, while it was 100 degree ambient air temperature.  A electric radiator
fan is use on the transmission cooler.  The c fast flow of air through this
radiator drops the water temperature a little below the ambient air
temperature.  So far, that maximum Zilla heat sink temperature I had so far,
was 98 F.

I run foam pipe insulation around the return line from the radiator to the
Zilla to help keep the water cooler.

Roland


----- Original Message -----
From: "TiM M" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 3:15 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Overheating Zilla?


> It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20 mile
> run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling about 200
> amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted into a
> convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best I could. I
> couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every time I try (once a
> year or so) I have the same problem and can't remember what it was I
> needed to do to get it to work... It's hell getting old, I hear your
> memory is the second thing to go, I forgot what the first thing was.
> Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten minutes with the water pump running
> and I drove it on home. I checked the temps when I got there, the water
> temp was ~125, the batteries were a little over 100. The Zilla case was
> showing 125-130. All temps from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway,
> I thought the Zilla throttled back before it cut out due to over
> temping... I went from fine to dead in a
>  split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10 minutes of
> sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road again...
> Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm pumping
> my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto the tranny
> cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside
>
> PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in Ventura,
> California at the fairgrounds.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Dave Brandt
In reply to this post by TiM M-3
For the first few sentences I thought I was rereading one of my old
posts.  Is your check engine light hooked up?  It starts flashing as
the Zilla starts to get too warm.  You definitely need a fan.  I have
one operating on an evsource.com cooling kit, and it still gets too hot
at the end of the drive, though it has never cut out.

--- TiM M <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20
> mile run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling
> about 200 amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted
> into a convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best
> I could. I couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every
> time I try (once a year or so) I have the same problem and can't
> remember what it was I needed to do to get it to work... It's hell
> getting old, I hear your memory is the second thing to go, I forgot
> what the first thing was. Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten
> minutes with the water pump running and I drove it on home. I checked
> the temps when I got there, the water temp was ~125, the batteries
> were a little over 100. The Zilla case was showing 125-130. All temps
> from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway, I thought the Zilla
> throttled back before it cut out due to over temping... I went from
> fine to dead in a
>  split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10
> minutes of sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road
> again...
> Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm
> pumping my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto
> the tranny cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside
>
> PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in
> Ventura, California at the fairgrounds.
>
>
>      
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>


David Brandt





     

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

drdhdmd
In reply to this post by TiM M-3
 
 
I'd say definitely.  When I first started using my Zilla it was 40  degrees
outside and It was fine without a fan on the "radiator".  Now that  its 80 or
more I noted that the "Check Engine" light started to flash.  I  had to use 2
fans to cover the entire radiator to help keep it's cool...
 
But as was already stated you should get a warning.  You do have a  "Check
Engine" light don't you?  It should come on when you turn on the  power and go
off after "pre Charge" is complete. It should have started blinking  before the
Zilla shut down.

Do I  need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm pumping my coolant  through?


 
Thank  you,

Dave Delman
1981 Electric DeLorean  Project
electricdelorean.com
http://evalbum.com/1482



**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars.      (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)
_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Rob Trahms
In reply to this post by Dave Brandt

As we're going through a record-breaking heat wave here in the PNW, I have started to notice this as well.  I have a Zilla cooling system (originally no fan though), and during each day's drive, I noticed the check engine light coming on earlier and earlier.  This was correlated to the ambient temperature getting hotter and hotter!  I have been using ZillaView to check temperature during the drive, and during the hottest days I was getting close to the shutoff limit of 80C (I think this is the shutoff limit).  I have since added a 12VDC computer fan to the radiator to help it cool down during those hilly drives on hot days.

Anyone know the temperature where the Zilla overheat signal starts to blink?  It seems like 60C or 65C from what I can tell.  I know that the duty cycle increases as you approach thermal cutoff.

Thanks,
Rob



Dave Brandt wrote
For the first few sentences I thought I was rereading one of my old
posts.  Is your check engine light hooked up?  It starts flashing as
the Zilla starts to get too warm.  You definitely need a fan.  I have
one operating on an evsource.com cooling kit, and it still gets too hot
at the end of the drive, though it has never cut out.

--- TiM M <mr_tim34@yahoo.com> wrote:

> It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20
> mile run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling
> about 200 amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted
> into a convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best
> I could. I couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every
> time I try (once a year or so) I have the same problem and can't
> remember what it was I needed to do to get it to work... It's hell
> getting old, I hear your memory is the second thing to go, I forgot
> what the first thing was. Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten
> minutes with the water pump running and I drove it on home. I checked
> the temps when I got there, the water temp was ~125, the batteries
> were a little over 100. The Zilla case was showing 125-130. All temps
> from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway, I thought the Zilla
> throttled back before it cut out due to over temping... I went from
> fine to dead in a
>  split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10
> minutes of sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road
> again...
> Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm
> pumping my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto
> the tranny cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside
>
> PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in
> Ventura, California at the fairgrounds.
>
>
>      
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>


David Brandt





     

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Roland Wiench
Hello Rod,

The maximum temperature my Z1k got to was 99 degrees F. when the ambient
temperature was 105 degrees F.   I cool the controller four different ways.

The controller is place inside a enclosure with the back of the heat sink
which is space about 1/2 from a aluminum chassis plate with nylon standoffs.
I pressurerize this enclosure with a 6 inch Dayton blower at 150 CFM.  There
is a exhaust grill to let the warm air out.

Next, I use the water cool unit that goes to one of those remote tanks that
are use for ICE vehicles that have a lower radiator than the engine.  Make
sure that this tank is higher then the Zilla.

A pump then pumps this coolent down to a second A/C radiator that is place
in front of the standard A/C radiator.  A large 16 inch standard electric
auto fan is use to cool this fluid.

The return line that goes back up to the Zilla is all double insulated with
black A/C line foam.  I also wrap this return line around one of the A/C
lines that come from the compressor which is the one is the coldest.

Roland

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Trahms" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 6:18 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Overheating Zilla?


>
>
> As we're going through a record-breaking heat wave here in the PNW, I have
> started to notice this as well.  I have a Zilla cooling system (originally
> no fan though), and during each day's drive, I noticed the check engine
> light coming on earlier and earlier.  This was correlated to the ambient
> temperature getting hotter and hotter!  I have been using ZillaView to
> check
> temperature during the drive, and during the hottest days I was getting
> close to the shutoff limit of 80C (I think this is the shutoff limit).  I
> have since added a 12VDC computer fan to the radiator to help it cool down
> during those hilly drives on hot days.
>
> Anyone know the temperature where the Zilla overheat signal starts to
> blink?
> It seems like 60C or 65C from what I can tell.  I know that the duty cycle
> increases as you approach thermal cutoff.
>
> Thanks,
> Rob
>
>
>
>
> Dave Brandt wrote:
> >
> > For the first few sentences I thought I was rereading one of my old
> > posts.  Is your check engine light hooked up?  It starts flashing as
> > the Zilla starts to get too warm.  You definitely need a fan.  I have
> > one operating on an evsource.com cooling kit, and it still gets too hot
> > at the end of the drive, though it has never cut out.
> >
> > --- TiM M <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> It was about 100 out yesterday, I was on the last 1/2 mile of my 20
> >> mile run home from work, the last 8 miles are up hill. I was pulling
> >> about 200 amps up a long hill when I suddenly lost power. I coasted
> >> into a convenient BK parking lot and started checking things as best
> >> I could. I couldn't get the %$#^% palm to talk to the Zilla, every
> >> time I try (once a year or so) I have the same problem and can't
> >> remember what it was I needed to do to get it to work... It's hell
> >> getting old, I hear your memory is the second thing to go, I forgot
> >> what the first thing was. Anyway, back to the EV. I sat for ten
> >> minutes with the water pump running and I drove it on home. I checked
> >> the temps when I got there, the water temp was ~125, the batteries
> >> were a little over 100. The Zilla case was showing 125-130. All temps
> >> from a Harbor Freight IR temp read out. Anyway, I thought the Zilla
> >> throttled back before it cut out due to over temping... I went from
> >> fine to dead in a
> >>  split second. I tried cycling the Zilla  to no avail, after 10
> >> minutes of sitting I cycled power to the Zilla and I was on the road
> >> again...
> >> Is this too hot? Do I need to add a fan to the tranny cooler I'm
> >> pumping my coolant through? I could add a mister to spray water onto
> >> the tranny cooler as well. All thoughts would be appreciated.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> TiM '61 Electric Corvair Rampside
> >>
> >> PS The Corvair National convention is being held next week in
> >> Ventura, California at the fairgrounds.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> For subscription options, see
> >> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >>
> >
> >
> > David Brandt
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
>
>
> -----
> Rob Trahms
> [hidden email]
> Electro - the Cabby-EV
> http://chaosmgmt.blogspot.com chaosmgmt.blogspot.com
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/Overheating-Zilla--tp17992262p24738300.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>

_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

KilowattA798
In reply to this post by TiM M-3
In a message dated 7/30/2009 7:28:16 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] Overheating Zilla?
> Date:7/30/2009 7:28:16 AM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[hidden email]
> Reply-to:[hidden email]
> To:[hidden email]
> Received from Internet:
>
> My S 10 truck with a (the best controller ever sold)Zill2KHV has gotten
> warm once in my driving here in Phoenix.

I do use ice water when drag racing this truck but never use more than a
tranny cooler when driving on the street. The tranny cooler does not have a
fan and is not even mounted in the front of the truck but underneath.
Dennis Berube

>
> Hello Rod,
>
> The maximum temperature my Z1k got to was 99 degrees F. when the ambient
> temperature was 105 degrees F.   I cool the controller four different
> ways.
>
> The controller is place inside a enclosure with the back of the heat sink
> which is space about 1/2 from a aluminum chassis plate with nylon
> standoffs.
> I pressurerize this enclosure with a 6 inch Dayton blower at 150 CFM.  
> There
> is a exhaust grill to let the warm air out.
>
> Next, I use the water cool unit that goes to one of those remote tanks
> that
> are use for ICE vehicles that have a lower radiator than the engine.  Make
>
> sure that this tank is higher then the Zilla.
>
> A pump then pumps this coolent down to a second A/C radiator that is place
>
> in front of the standard A/C radiator.  A large 16 inch standard electric
> auto fan is use to cool this fluid.
>
> The return line that goes back up to the Zilla is all double insulated
> with
> black A/C line foam.  I also wrap this return line around one of the A/C
> lines that come from the compressor which is the one is the coldest.
>
> Roland
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20090730/be9fba04/attachment.html 
_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Overheating Zilla?

Steve Skarda
I have problems with my 'check engine' light flashing anytime ambient is
over 85 degF.  My max battery amps are set to 300 so I am not pushing it
really hard.  It happens to me going 60 mph so I don't believe a fan would
help me.   If I remember correctly ZillaView had temperatures in the range
of 140 - 155 degF ~60-70 degC).  While I have a good sized water pump
& reservoir, and 3/8" tubing, I suspect my problem is that I left the tubes
on the transmission cooler which are sized much smaller than 3/8" so I think
that is limiting flow lower than 2 gpm stated in the manual.  My plan is to
remove those lines and replace them with something larger so I can get my
cooling water flow up.  Regardless, increasing coolant flow will fix my
problem.
One other interesting point is that I do believe that my Zilla temperature
sensor is calibrated very conservatively.  I keep forgetting to check it
first thing in the morning but I think my temperature would read 10 deg
above ambient prior to running any amps through the controller.

Regarding how the ZIlla works, from the manual:
The controller will maintain full output motor current up to 55 degrees C
heatsink temperature. Above that, current drops back to 75% at 80 degrees C
and then rapidly declines to nothing at 100 degrees C. The controller is
designed to protect itself in an overheat condition, but running it hot can
shorten its life.

Roland-  I would love to see your car sometime.  Too bad I don't live near
you.  You have obviously put a ton of work into your EV.   I remember one of
your other posts talking about redundant systems.  It would never occur to
me to use A/C to cool the controller BELOW ambient.  Impressive.



On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 11:11 AM, <[hidden email]> wrote:

> In a message dated 7/30/2009 7:28:16 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
> [hidden email] writes:
> > Subj: Re: [EVDL] Overheating Zilla?
> > Date:7/30/2009 7:28:16 AM US Mountain Standard Time
> > From:[hidden email] <From%[hidden email]>
> > Reply-to:[hidden email] <Reply-to%[hidden email]>
> > To:[hidden email] <To%[hidden email]>
> > Received from Internet:
> >
> > My S 10 truck with a (the best controller ever sold)Zill2KHV has gotten
> > warm once in my driving here in Phoenix.
>
> I do use ice water when drag racing this truck but never use more than a
> tranny cooler when driving on the street. The tranny cooler does not have a
> fan and is not even mounted in the front of the truck but underneath.
> Dennis Berube
>
> >
> > Hello Rod,
> >
> > The maximum temperature my Z1k got to was 99 degrees F. when the ambient
> > temperature was 105 degrees F.   I cool the controller four different
> > ways.
> >
> > The controller is place inside a enclosure with the back of the heat sink
> > which is space about 1/2 from a aluminum chassis plate with nylon
> > standoffs.
> > I pressurerize this enclosure with a 6 inch Dayton blower at 150 CFM.
> > There
> > is a exhaust grill to let the warm air out.
> >
> > Next, I use the water cool unit that goes to one of those remote tanks
> > that
> > are use for ICE vehicles that have a lower radiator than the engine.
>  Make
> >
> > sure that this tank is higher then the Zilla.
> >
> > A pump then pumps this coolent down to a second A/C radiator that is
> place
> >
> > in front of the standard A/C radiator.  A large 16 inch standard electric
> > auto fan is use to cool this fluid.
> >
> > The return line that goes back up to the Zilla is all double insulated
> > with
> > black A/C line foam.  I also wrap this return line around one of the A/C
> > lines that come from the compressor which is the one is the coldest.
> >
> > Roland
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20090730/be9fba04/attachment.html
> _______________________________________________
> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20090730/2029737c/attachment.html 
_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev