Registration in Florida of an EV

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Registration in Florida of an EV

Walter E. Sergeant
I am in the process of completing the conversion of a '01 Ranger, ala  
Al Lococo, my mentor. The state license expired 2/09 and I went to the  
tax assessors office to renew it. I informed the lady the truck was  
being converted to all electric and asked what if anything the state  
required on licensing or registration. There was a pow wow with the  
office manager and they called the part of DMV that deals with  
rebuilds from accidents and community electrics (25 mph). The verbal  
response was that I cannot do it. When asked why the rational was  
there there was no state procedure for checking out conversions. I was  
informed to call Tallahassee, state headquarters for FL DMV. Nobody  
there could come up with a procedure and I was referred to a 800  
telephone number which turned out to be the prior authority called.  
The person took pertinent information and said that I would get a call  
back. That was five months ago and no call back.
Walt  FL EAA #3690


Walter E. Sergeant
16301 Gemini Ct.
Fort Myers, FL 33908
239.454.1243
[hidden email]




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Re: Registration in Florida of an EV

Seth Rothenberg
On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 3:46 PM, Walter E. Sergeant<[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Nobody there could come up with a procedure and I was referred
>>> to a 800 telephone number which turned out to be the prior
>>> authority called.

I had a similar thing in NJ, called everyone in Trenton,
was told it can't be done.
Wrote to the Governor on his web site,
got a letter from the head of the DOT,
telling the procedure for Specially constructed vehicle.

However, I know two people who did not do this.

They made an appointment for inspection
at the specialty inspection station (2 weeks in advance),
then they registered the car, and were given 2 weeks
to get inspected.   Neither person had the title
updated, so therefore, neither is entitled to use a
green pass to get 1/2 off the George Washington Bridge
off-peak.

And these "gas" cars...don't get counted in the EV census
in the US, so when the governor is trying to decide
whether to put an RV outlet at every rest area on the
turnpike....why should he, no-one drives EVs anyway.


Good luck
Seth

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Re: Registration in Florida of an EV

Metabus
In reply to this post by Walter E. Sergeant
Walt, your unfortunate experience is illustrative of the guerrilla warfare required to deal with such state agencies.

I see no reason to inform the DMV of engine changes when registering a motor vehicle.

If you had pulled a 4- or 6-cylinder ICE and replaced it with a V8? If you'd converted a diesel Mercedes to consume vegetable oil?

Since the state has no one qualified or willing to document an approval of changes made to your vehicle, I say you should just re-register the original VIN. This has been the procedure followed by most converters. I've heard nothing but horror stories from people who attempt to inform the state of changes they've made. Even when there is something to be gained (like HOV lane endorsements, or government tax credits), the cost (the hoops you have to jump through) appears to outweigh the benefit.

They have provisions here in Florida for getting a new VIN for 'home-built' vehicles.  But, for a simple conversion such as yours, I'd suggest just taking the old reg and title in and renewing (if that is still possible).

We might, eventually, get funding and recognition for the conversion process, but for now, I respectfully suggest that EV-incognito is the way to go...

Walter E. Sergeant wrote
I am in the process of completing the conversion of a '01 Ranger, ala  
Al Lococo, my mentor. The state license expired 2/09 and I went to the  
tax assessors office to renew it. I informed the lady the truck was  
being converted to all electric and asked what if anything the state  
required on licensing or registration. There was a pow wow with the  
office manager and they called the part of DMV that deals with  
rebuilds from accidents and community electrics (25 mph). The verbal  
response was that I cannot do it. When asked why the rational was  
there there was no state procedure for checking out conversions. I was  
informed to call Tallahassee, state headquarters for FL DMV. Nobody  
there could come up with a procedure and I was referred to a 800  
telephone number which turned out to be the prior authority called.  
The person took pertinent information and said that I would get a call  
back. That was five months ago and no call back.
Walt  FL EAA #3690


Walter E. Sergeant
16301 Gemini Ct.
Fort Myers, FL 33908
239.454.1243
walter@sergeant.com




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Re: Registration in NJ of an EV

Douglas A. Stansfield
In reply to this post by Seth Rothenberg
Seth,

I don't quite understand why you keep wanting a Title that says it is an EV.
The Inspection Station in NJ takes the VIN number of the vehicle and then
inspects it and then exempts it from all future emissions tests (as most of
the inspection is all about emissions anyway) and I don't have to return to
get it inspected again until 2011!!!  The inspection was cake.  The more
light you shine on the EV world to government bearocrats (is this a new one
Bob Rice or did you already come up with that one) the more likely it will
get much more complicated in the future to pass inspection with a converted
car.

I have Electric Badges on my car now and I even put in very big letters
"ELECTRIC VEHICLE" on each side (www.EVAlbum.com/1973) see the pictures at
EV Album.  If I get to the GW bridge (highly unlikely while I have Lead Acid
batteries) I am quite sure that people will see the writing and then I would
get the credit.  I can't test it as I live 60 miles from the bridge and my
range is about 20 to 25 miles with only 8 12v Lead Acid batteries on board.

The only thing you need a Title for is to show that you own the car.  I
could care less what the government statistics are as technically they
already know that it is an Electric car based on the VIN#.  It is there
problem to figure this out.

Obviously when you sell it and register it, no one asks at registration if
it is Electric so why tell them.  They take the old title (and if their
computer systems where hooked up together which who knows if they are or
not) and then issue the new buyer a new one.

I am 100% legal to drive my EV in NJ and I have followed the rules they have
laid out.  I retain title, I drive the car and I passed inspection with it
as is.  Why ask for more work to do....?

Don't over complicate this my friend.  Finish your conversion, take it over
to Morristown and get it inspected.  You will be very happy you did and you
will have a new clean inspection sticker good until 2011 on it and a big
cheesy EV grin all over your face.  It is that simple.

I am also very jealous of those Lithium Batteries you have now!!!!  Good job
buddy.  I really want to see that car finished and at the next NJ Electric
Auto Association meeting!!!!!

Sincerely;

Douglas A. Stansfield
President, NJ Electric Auto Association
www.TransAtlanticElectricConversions.com

973-875-6276 (office)
973-670-9208 (cell)




-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
Of Seth Rothenberg
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 4:03 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Registration in Florida of an EV

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 3:46 PM, Walter E. Sergeant<[hidden email]>
wrote:
>>> Nobody there could come up with a procedure and I was referred
>>> to a 800 telephone number which turned out to be the prior
>>> authority called.

I had a similar thing in NJ, called everyone in Trenton,
was told it can't be done.
Wrote to the Governor on his web site,
got a letter from the head of the DOT,
telling the procedure for Specially constructed vehicle.

However, I know two people who did not do this.

They made an appointment for inspection
at the specialty inspection station (2 weeks in advance),
then they registered the car, and were given 2 weeks
to get inspected.   Neither person had the title
updated, so therefore, neither is entitled to use a
green pass to get 1/2 off the George Washington Bridge
off-peak.

And these "gas" cars...don't get counted in the EV census
in the US, so when the governor is trying to decide
whether to put an RV outlet at every rest area on the
turnpike....why should he, no-one drives EVs anyway.


Good luck
Seth

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Re: Registration in NJ of an EV

Seth Rothenberg
Doug,

>> If I get to the GW bridge (highly unlikely while I have Lead Acid
>> batteries) I am quite sure that people will see the writing....

RFID can't read "ELECTRIC VEHICLE" even in very big letters.

If there are 0 vehicles in the area with fuel type ELECTRIC,
it will be hard for us to get the rules changed to include us.
You can see the rules here:

http://www.nysthruway.gov/ezpass/greentag.html

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Re: Registration in NJ of an EV

Douglas A. Stansfield
So Seth,

I just read the rules and only 3 cars are currently considered qualified.

Since this is totally an outside the box kind of thing for most
people....including EZPass people....my recommendation is to drive your
completed (licensed, registered and inspected) EV to the nearest EZPass
location (I really don't know where they are as I haven't paid mine in a
while and I think they will shut it off soon)  and walk into the office and
ask any of the workers there if they want to see a 100% electric car.  This
approach has never ceased to work in any format that I have tried it in.
Any location.  People stop what they are doing, walk outside and are amazed
that a battery powered EV is sitting in front of them.  Then show them that
there is absolutely no emissions coming out of the car and to ask why you
can't get a green pass.

I have tried to call EZ Pass regarding my own account and it is almost
impossible to reach an actual person.  I have forgotten my Pin number so I
will have to write them a letter and hope they get it.  Anyway, since I
don't use EZpass that much, it really hasn't been a high priority.  Maybe if
I have time tomorrow I will send in the letter.

Let me know if you want me to try and help you with this.  Say that you are
a member of the NJ Electric Auto Association and need to get things started
as more and more people have converted Electric Cars now than ever before.
There are probably 25 plus EVs in the state right now.  Notice that Tesla
isn't even on that list of cars.....and that car has no emissions!!!!


Sincerely;

Douglas A. Stansfield
President, NJ Electric Auto Association
www.TransAtlanticElectricConversions.com
www.EVAlbum.com/1973

973-875-6276 (office)
973-670-9208 (cell)





-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
Of Seth Rothenberg
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 11:39 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Registration in NJ of an EV

Doug,

>> If I get to the GW bridge (highly unlikely while I have Lead Acid
>> batteries) I am quite sure that people will see the writing....

RFID can't read "ELECTRIC VEHICLE" even in very big letters.

If there are 0 vehicles in the area with fuel type ELECTRIC,
it will be hard for us to get the rules changed to include us.
You can see the rules here:

http://www.nysthruway.gov/ezpass/greentag.html

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Re: Registration in NJ of an EV

Seth Rothenberg
On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Douglas A.
Stansfield<[hidden email]> wrote:
> There are probably 25 plus EVs in the state right now.  Notice that Tesla
> isn't even on that list of cars.....and that car has no emissions!!!!

That's a good place to start.

They have a sales office in New York State,
so New York State ought to recognize it.

Then we can work on NJ.

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