Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

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Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Hi,

I am new to this listing, so forgive me if I commit some blunder in this
post!

I have two Vectrix VX-1 scooters in need of batteries, and it appears that
Leaf cells are well suited for a retro-fit. One complete Leaf battery pack
would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19 modules for each
bike).

I am aware that there are online vendors of used Leaf cells (Ebay,
HybridAuto, etc.) but they are costly.  One complete Leaf battery pack would
provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19 modules for each bike).

I can only ride one bike at a time (and I only have one BMS right now) so my
immediate desire is to locate enough decent cells to power one of the
scooters.

Anyone out there got a line on a Leaf battery pack they would like to split?
Any Vectrix hobbyists out there?

Thanks

Matt

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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Matt,
Where are you located?
BTW, the EVDL is not for commercial advertisements, but anyone working
on their own EVs
can ask for as well as offer parts for sale. Also, if there is a
question on the list and someone
who does work commercially in the requested field, can reply with the
requested info.
(See the occasional report that David is giving us of what is/is not
allowed)

Anyway,
I have a complete set of cells from a 2015 Leaf in the garage (already
removed from the shell)
as well as a set with much deteriorated capacity from I believe a 2011.
Obviously the prices are quite different between the two.
Let's take that discussion offline and shoot me an email.
BTW, I am in Silicon Valley
and I have worked on Vectrix in the past. Quite some years ago when the
first ones were converted
to Lithium, I bought the damaged/incomplete NiMH packs that were taken
out and sold cells or
modules to others who were patching up their own damaged packs.
I also worked on Vectrix with damaged charger (from too long extension
cord, so the constant power
charger was drawing too much current, blowing itself up - a known
problem)
Cor.

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of mattlogan55---
via EV
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2018 9:32 PM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: [EVDL] Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Hi,

I am new to this listing, so forgive me if I commit some blunder in this
post!

I have two Vectrix VX-1 scooters in need of batteries, and it appears
that Leaf cells are well suited for a retro-fit. One complete Leaf
battery pack would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19
modules for each bike).

I am aware that there are online vendors of used Leaf cells (Ebay,
HybridAuto, etc.) but they are costly.  One complete Leaf battery pack
would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19 modules for each
bike).

I can only ride one bike at a time (and I only have one BMS right now)
so my immediate desire is to locate enough decent cells to power one of
the scooters.

Anyone out there got a line on a Leaf battery pack they would like to
split?
Any Vectrix hobbyists out there?

Thanks

Matt

--
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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
This is an attempt at a private conversation with Cor concerning his response to my post on the Oeva list.  If this is inadvertently being posted to the general public list, I am hoping that the moderator will bar it, and send me a friendly email on how to respond privately in the correct manner!

Cor, I am located in the Portland/Vancouver area, but have family in the Bay Area (Palo Alto, Tracy).

I would be interested in talking with you concerning the 2015 cells, and about your experience with the Vectrix in general.  I fought with the original NiMh cells for a while, then installed an Orien BMS and some of the lousy BP Li iron phosphate cells which have since failed.  I'm tired of looking at 2 bikes sitting unused. Time to use them or loose them.

My email: [hidden email]

Thanks,

Matt

<quote author='Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list'>
Matt,
Where are you located?
BTW, the EVDL is not for commercial advertisements, but anyone working
on their own EVs
can ask for as well as offer parts for sale. Also, if there is a
question on the list and someone
who does work commercially in the requested field, can reply with the
requested info.
(See the occasional report that David is giving us of what is/is not
allowed)

Anyway,
I have a complete set of cells from a 2015 Leaf in the garage (already
removed from the shell)
as well as a set with much deteriorated capacity from I believe a 2011.
Obviously the prices are quite different between the two.
Let's take that discussion offline and shoot me an email.
BTW, I am in Silicon Valley
and I have worked on Vectrix in the past. Quite some years ago when the
first ones were converted
to Lithium, I bought the damaged/incomplete NiMH packs that were taken
out and sold cells or
modules to others who were patching up their own damaged packs.
I also worked on Vectrix with damaged charger (from too long extension
cord, so the constant power
charger was drawing too much current, blowing itself up - a known
problem)
Cor.

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of mattlogan55---
via EV
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2018 9:32 PM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: [EVDL] Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Hi,

I am new to this listing, so forgive me if I commit some blunder in this
post!

I have two Vectrix VX-1 scooters in need of batteries, and it appears
that Leaf cells are well suited for a retro-fit. One complete Leaf
battery pack would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19
modules for each bike).

I am aware that there are online vendors of used Leaf cells (Ebay,
HybridAuto, etc.) but they are costly.  One complete Leaf battery pack
would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19 modules for each
bike).

I can only ride one bike at a time (and I only have one BMS right now)
so my immediate desire is to locate enough decent cells to power one of
the scooters.

Anyone out there got a line on a Leaf battery pack they would like to
split?
Any Vectrix hobbyists out there?

Thanks

Matt

--
Sent from: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/
_______________________________________________
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</quote>
Quoted from:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Searching-for-a-source-for-2013-and-newer-Leaf-cells-tp4689306p4689307.html


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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Matt,

Your message did go large. But I would say this is of interest to "the
list" if you are going to discuss experiences with different cells and
experiences with Vectrix. When you are discussing shipping arrangements
and pricing for parts or services, that probably should be "off list".

By the way, it's pretty easy to reply privately. Just "reply all" and
then delete everything except the poster's personal email address.

(P.S. I'm not the moderator.)

Peri

------ Original Message ------
From: "Matth Logan via EV" <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Cc: [hidden email]
Sent: 30-Jan-18 8:53:02 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

>This is an attempt at a private conversation with Cor concerning his
>response to my post on the Oeva list.  If this is inadvertently being
>posted to the general public list, I am hoping that the moderator will
>bar it, and send me a friendly email on how to respond privately in the
>correct manner!
>
>Cor, I am located in the Portland/Vancouver area, but have family in
>the Bay Area (Palo Alto, Tracy).
>
>I would be interested in talking with you concerning the 2015 cells,
>and about your experience with the Vectrix in general.  I fought with
>the original NiMh cells for a while, then installed an Orien BMS and
>some of the lousy BP Li iron phosphate cells which have since failed.  
>I'm tired of looking at 2 bikes sitting unused. Time to use them or
>loose them.
>
>My email: [hidden email]
>
>Thanks,
>
>Matt
>
><quote author='Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list'>
>Matt,
>Where are you located?
>BTW, the EVDL is not for commercial advertisements, but anyone working
>on their own EVs
>can ask for as well as offer parts for sale. Also, if there is a
>question on the list and someone
>who does work commercially in the requested field, can reply with the
>requested info.
>(See the occasional report that David is giving us of what is/is not
>allowed)
>
>Anyway,
>I have a complete set of cells from a 2015 Leaf in the garage (already
>removed from the shell)
>as well as a set with much deteriorated capacity from I believe a 2011.
>Obviously the prices are quite different between the two.
>Let's take that discussion offline and shoot me an email.
>BTW, I am in Silicon Valley
>and I have worked on Vectrix in the past. Quite some years ago when the
>first ones were converted
>to Lithium, I bought the damaged/incomplete NiMH packs that were taken
>out and sold cells or
>modules to others who were patching up their own damaged packs.
>I also worked on Vectrix with damaged charger (from too long extension
>cord, so the constant power
>charger was drawing too much current, blowing itself up - a known
>problem)
>Cor.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of mattlogan55---
>via EV
>Sent: Monday, January 29, 2018 9:32 PM
>To: [hidden email]
>Cc: [hidden email]
>Subject: [EVDL] Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells
>
>Hi,
>
>I am new to this listing, so forgive me if I commit some blunder in
>this
>post!
>
>I have two Vectrix VX-1 scooters in need of batteries, and it appears
>that Leaf cells are well suited for a retro-fit. One complete Leaf
>battery pack would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19
>modules for each bike).
>
>I am aware that there are online vendors of used Leaf cells (Ebay,
>HybridAuto, etc.) but they are costly.  One complete Leaf battery pack
>would provide enough cells for both scooters (need 19 modules for each
>bike).
>
>I can only ride one bike at a time (and I only have one BMS right now)
>so my immediate desire is to locate enough decent cells to power one of
>the scooters.
>
>Anyone out there got a line on a Leaf battery pack they would like to
>split?
>Any Vectrix hobbyists out there?
>
>Thanks
>
>Matt
>
>--
>Sent from:
>http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/
>_______________________________________________
>UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
>http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
>Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA
>(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>
>_______________________________________________
>UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
>http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
>Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA
>(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>
>
></quote>
>Quoted from:
>http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Searching-for-a-source-for-2013-and-newer-Leaf-cells-tp4689306p4689307.html
>
>
>_____________________________________
>Sent from http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
>http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
>Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA
>(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>

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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list


On 01/30/2018 11:56 AM, Peri Hartman via EV wrote:
> Matt,
>
> Your message did go large. But I would say this is of interest to "the
> list" if you are going to discuss experiences with different cells and
> experiences with Vectrix. When you are discussing shipping arrangements
> and pricing for parts or services, that probably should be "off list".

Agree.

Since NiMH has such a sterling reputation in EV1s and RAV4EVs, I'm
interested in hearing about the problems in Vectrix.

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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list


On 01/30/2018 11:56 AM, Peri Hartman via EV wrote:
> Matt,
>
> Your message did go large. But I would say this is of interest to "the
> list" if you are going to discuss experiences with different cells and
> experiences with Vectrix. When you are discussing shipping arrangements
> and pricing for parts or services, that probably should be "off list".

Agree.

Since NiMH has such a sterling reputation in EV1s and RAV4EVs, I'm
interested in hearing about the trouble in Vectrix.

_______________________________________________
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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Generally speaking, there is a lot to like about the Vectrix Vx-1 (when it is
running), but also a few fatal problems, painstakingly documented on the ‘V
is for Voltage’ Vectrix forum.

Concerning the Vectrix NiMH batteries specifically, I think it was mostly
that there were 105 prismatic NiMH cells without any real battery
management, with questionable factory charge/discharge parameters, and
questionable cell quality. These oversights resulted in overheated (swollen)
and damaged cells within the pack. Combine that with a company that was
mostly in a state of bankruptcy, and you have the Vectrix experience.
Fortunately, I did not buy my scooters new, so my experience has been
frustrating, but not too expensive.    


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Re: Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
What I have seen from the Vectrix design and what their sales was pushing for,
was that the Vectrix design incorporated NiMH cells that were pushed several times
beyond their max ratings.
I believe that the max rating for the cells was in the range of 100 Amps and initially the
Vectrix was limited to below 150 or 200A max draws, but that resulted in a top speed, I believe
just below 60 MPH.
That was unacceptable for the sales team, so they forced the engineering team to open the
max draw up until the Vextrix could hit a top of 67 MPH and they could put that in the
sales brochure and sell it as freeway capable without customer pushback.

However, the pushback came from physics, since the cells were now pushed about
3 times beyond their max rating to about 300A so even the main 225A fuse started blowing.
The scooter is not designed to be taken apart easily, so fixing that was a major hassle
and the extreme current draws caused the pack to overheat, despite 2 large and very
good quality cooling fans (I still have one set) the cells died early. another contributing
factor was that charging would commence full power and add more heat even when
the pack was already overheated if plugged in immediately upon return from a trip, which is
the natural moment to plug in.
Grass-roots support actually released a software version that allowed a cool-down between
drive and charging and throttle the charging to lower current so the cells had a chance to
survive.
It was not that the NiMH cells were bad per se, they were abused to death.

-----Original Message-----
From: EV [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of mattlogan55--- via EV
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2018 11:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Searching for a source for 2013 and newer Leaf cells

Generally speaking, there is a lot to like about the Vectrix Vx-1 (when it is running), but also a few fatal problems, painstakingly documented on the ‘V is for Voltage’ Vectrix forum.

Concerning the Vectrix NiMH batteries specifically, I think it was mostly that there were 105 prismatic NiMH cells without any real battery management, with questionable factory charge/discharge parameters, and questionable cell quality. These oversights resulted in overheated (swollen) and damaged cells within the pack. Combine that with a company that was mostly in a state of bankruptcy, and you have the Vectrix experience.
Fortunately, I did not buy my scooters new, so my experience has been
frustrating, but not too expensive.    


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