Weird Rear Brush Sparking

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Weird Rear Brush Sparking

Mark Hanson-2
Weird rear brush sparking.
 
On my 9" Impulse Netgain series wound motor, the rear (towards the tail shaft) brushes keep wearing down every 3K miles and sparking.  has anyone had a similar problem and know what the cure is?
 
Best Regards,
mark E . Hanson
in Roanoke, VA
www.REEVA.info
     
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Re: Weird Rear Brush Sparking

Jeff Major
Hi Mark,

My first thought is damage or a discontinuity to the commutator surface.  This can be checked with a dial indicator.  If found, lathe turning may be needed.  Also check for high mica.  The other things to check are all electrical connects and spring pressures.  Make sure all brushes slide smoothly in the respective holders.

Jeff M.




________________________________
 From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 8, 2013 7:17 AM
Subject: [EVDL] Weird Rear Brush Sparking
 

Weird rear brush sparking.

On my 9" Impulse Netgain series wound motor, the rear (towards the tail shaft) brushes keep wearing down every 3K miles and sparking.  has anyone had a similar problem and know what the cure is?

Best Regards,
mark E . Hanson
in Roanoke, VA
www.REEVA.info
                           
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Re: Weird Rear Brush Sparking

Ruckus
Major's suggestions are all pertinent.  It seems strange that only one set
are wearing fast and sparking more.  Could this be inadequate spring
pressure allowing intermittent contact and thus accelerated wear?

I will be chastised for saying this, but the only true solution is to get a
brushless motor.  I'm doing that this year, so we'll see how it goes...

Good luck,
Marcus


On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 6:03 AM, Jeff Major <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Mark,
>
> My first thought is damage or a discontinuity to the commutator surface.
> This can be checked with a dial indicator.  If found, lathe turning may be
> needed.  Also check for high mica.  The other things to check are all
> electrical connects and spring pressures.  Make sure all brushes slide
> smoothly in the respective holders.
>
> Jeff M.
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>  From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
> To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 8, 2013 7:17 AM
> Subject: [EVDL] Weird Rear Brush Sparking
>
>
> Weird rear brush sparking.
>
> On my 9" Impulse Netgain series wound motor, the rear (towards the tail
> shaft) brushes keep wearing down every 3K miles and sparking.  has anyone
> had a similar problem and know what the cure is?
>
> Best Regards,
> mark E . Hanson
> in Roanoke, VA
> www.REEVA.info
>
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>


--
Marcus Reddish

*North Valley Systems LLC*
Stevensville, Montana
406-360-8628
northvalleyev.com
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Re: Weird Rear Brush Sparking

Roland Wiench
In reply to this post by Mark Hanson-2
The rear brushes of a dual set will wear down faster than the front brushes.
The rear brushes may shunt the front brushes thus more current flow through
them.

My first motor was a GE-11 that was blue printed by a GE company in
Michigan. They v-groove the communtator just enough to take off the
communtators bars sharp edges.  Then they micro mirror the surface to a
mirror surface.

This motor was ran from 1976 to 2000 before pulling it out for maintenance.
The rear brushes were half the length of the front brushes.  This shorten
length will cause lower spring tension then the front brushes.

I use a WarP 11 spare motor while I have the GE-11 motor in maintenance.  I
first run the WarP 11 motor non blue printed on a motor test stand to check
the running action. The communtator bars had very rough edges and surfaces
where you can cut yourself.

Run the motor to see what the brush action was, and as I suspected, there
was a lot of brush chatter which started to chip the edge of the brushes.  I
than remove the rotor and V-groove the communtator bars with a V-file and
than micro mirror the communtator on a lathe using a fine crocus cloth.

Before installing this type of motor in a EV, it is recommended to take and
record the ohm value throw the rotor circuit, rotor to motor frame, field
circuit and field to motor frame.

Normally a brush type motor should read over 20 meg/ohms to the motor frame.
In about 10 years this reading could be reduce to 50 K/ohms where it is
recommended for maintenance.

The problem with a brush motor is that the brush dust tracks from the face
of the communtator down on to the motor shaft which causes a current leak to
the frame of the vehicle.  This is why some people has read a voltage on the
frame of there EV even if the batteries are in a isolated non-conductor
battery box.

Roland




----- Original Message -----
From: "Marcus Reddish" <[hidden email]>
To: "Jeff Major" <[hidden email]>; "Electric Vehicle Discussion List"
<[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Weird Rear Brush Sparking


> Major's suggestions are all pertinent.  It seems strange that only one set
> are wearing fast and sparking more.  Could this be inadequate spring
> pressure allowing intermittent contact and thus accelerated wear?
>
> I will be chastised for saying this, but the only true solution is to get
> a
> brushless motor.  I'm doing that this year, so we'll see how it goes...
>
> Good luck,
> Marcus
>
>
> On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 6:03 AM, Jeff Major <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Hi Mark,
> >
> > My first thought is damage or a discontinuity to the commutator surface.
> > This can be checked with a dial indicator.  If found, lathe turning may
> > be
> > needed.  Also check for high mica.  The other things to check are all
> > electrical connects and spring pressures.  Make sure all brushes slide
> > smoothly in the respective holders.
> >
> > Jeff M.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >  From: Mark Hanson <[hidden email]>
> > To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 8, 2013 7:17 AM
> > Subject: [EVDL] Weird Rear Brush Sparking
> >
> >
> > Weird rear brush sparking.
> >
> > On my 9" Impulse Netgain series wound motor, the rear (towards the tail
> > shaft) brushes keep wearing down every 3K miles and sparking.  has
> > anyone
> > had a similar problem and know what the cure is?
> >
> > Best Regards,
> > mark E . Hanson
> > in Roanoke, VA
> > www.REEVA.info
> >
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> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
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> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Marcus Reddish
>
> *North Valley Systems LLC*
> Stevensville, Montana
> 406-360-8628
> northvalleyev.com
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>
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Re: Weird Rear Brush Sparking

KilowattA798
In reply to this post by Mark Hanson-2
In a message dated 5/8/2013 11:43:10 AM Mountain Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:

> Subj:Re: [EVDL] Weird Rear Brush Sparking
> Date:5/8/2013 11:43:10 AM Mountain Standard Time
> From:[hidden email]
> Reply-to:[hidden email]
> To:[hidden email], [hidden email]
> Received from Internet:
>
>
>
> The rear brushes of a dual set will wear down faster than the front
> brushes.
> The rear brushes may shunt the front brushes thus more current flow
> through
> them.
>
> My first motor was a GE-11 that was blue printed by a GE company in
> Michigan. They v-groove the communtator just enough to take off the
> communtators bars sharp edges.  Then they micro mirror the surface to a
> mirror surface.
>
> This motor was ran from 1976 to 2000 before pulling it out for
> maintenance.
> The rear brushes were half the length of the front brushes.  This shorten
> length will cause lower spring tension then the front brushes.
>
> I use a WarP 11 spare motor while I have the GE-11 motor in maintenance.  
> I
> first run the WarP 11 motor non blue printed on a motor test stand to
> check
> the running action. The communtator bars had very rough edges and surfaces
>
> where you can cut yourself.
>
> Run the motor to see what the brush action was, and as I suspected, there
> was a lot of brush chatter which started to chip the edge of the brushes.  
> I
> than remove the rotor and V-groove the communtator bars with a V-file and
> than micro mirror the communtator on a lathe using a fine crocus cloth.
>
> Before installing this type of motor in a EV, it is recommended to take
> and
> record the ohm value throw the rotor circuit, rotor to motor frame, field
> circuit and field to motor frame.
>
> Normally a brush type motor should read over 20 meg/ohms to the motor
> frame.
> In about 10 years this reading could be reduce to 50 K/ohms where it is
> recommended for maintenance.
>
> The problem with a brush motor is that the brush dust tracks from the face
>
> of the communtator down on to the motor shaft which causes a current leak
> to
> the frame of the vehicle.  This is why some people has read a voltage on
> the
> frame of there EV even if the batteries are in a isolated non-conductor
> battery box.
>
> Roland
>
Good post here Roland.I have in the past(my dragster and S10)removed some
shunt lead from the inside(rear) brush because of the above.I wanted ALL the
brushes to Share equally.Also check the spring pressure.
Dennis Berube
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