What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

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What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.

Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did try
to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.

If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
couple years?

Cell details
48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com

Thanks,

Barry
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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

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     Why don’t you use them to build your own home energy storage system at home? You can build a 48v system (3P-16Series of your CALBs) you would have 180Ah x 3. Couldn’t those cells still have at least 30% capacity left, Maybe more? But enough to power your home for half a day on basic appliances like lamps, internet and TVs.

      If you want to go pro, you could use the VFXR series from Outback Power (http://www.outbackpower.com/products/inverter-chargers/fxr-vfxr-series) which is a 120/240 since wave inverter grid tie and island capable, and have the ability to charge from the grid/solar, buy and sell electricity depending on your rates from day/night and power your house in a black out event.

      At least that’s what I’d like to do on my next opportunity.

Marco Gaxiola

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2018, at 9:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
> my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
>
> Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did try
> to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
> nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
>
> If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
> having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
> couple years?
>
> Cell details
> 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
> The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
> estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
> www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
>
> Thanks,
>
> Barry
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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Marco,

Thanks for the suggestion.  We actually have solar with battery backup
(FLA).  I've thought about adding them to our system.  Unfortunately we
have an older charge inverter that doesn't support LiOn charging.  I
probably could could find a way to wire the current BMS and batteries into
the system.  More of a project time issue.

If we had TOU I definitely would just charge them off the grid and
arbitrage as you suggest.  No TOU in PA.

Barry

On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 4:58 PM, Ing. Marco Gaxiola <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>      Why don’t you use them to build your own home energy storage system
> at home? You can build a 48v system (3P-16Series of your CALBs) you would
> have 180Ah x 3. Couldn’t those cells still have at least 30% capacity left,
> Maybe more? But enough to power your home for half a day on basic
> appliances like lamps, internet and TVs.
>
>       If you want to go pro, you could use the VFXR series from Outback
> Power (http://www.outbackpower.com/products/inverter-chargers/
> fxr-vfxr-series) which is a 120/240 since wave inverter grid tie and
> island capable, and have the ability to charge from the grid/solar, buy and
> sell electricity depending on your rates from day/night and power your
> house in a black out event.
>
>       At least that’s what I’d like to do on my next opportunity.
>
> Marco Gaxiola
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 9, 2018, at 9:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
> my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
>
> Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did try
> to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
> nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
>
> If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
> having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
> couple years?
>
> Cell details
> 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
> The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
> estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
> www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
>
> Thanks,
>
> Barry
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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

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In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
I agree with Marco.

To my knowledge, squeezing out the rest of the life through energy storage is really the only next useful stage for these batteries. The y cannot be recycled.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2018, at 6:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
> my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
>
> Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did try
> to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
> nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
>
> If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
> having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
> couple years?
>
> Cell details
> 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
> The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
> estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
> www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
>
> Thanks,
>
> Barry
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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

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I don’t see why not. Cut them open separate the copper foil from the aluminum and recycle them normally. You could just leave the graphene and lithium slurry on there.

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 9, 2018, at 4:16 PM, Mark Abramowitz via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I agree with Marco.
>
> To my knowledge, squeezing out the rest of the life through energy storage is really the only next useful stage for these batteries. The y cannot be recycled.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 9, 2018, at 6:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
>> my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
>>
>> Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did try
>> to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
>> nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
>>
>> If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
>> having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
>> couple years?
>>
>> Cell details
>> 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
>> The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
>> estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
>> www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Barry
>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>
>
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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
I don’t know.

Perhaps it’s possible to partially recycle, or maybe it’s not
economical.

I’ve only read about or asked the broader question. Not the why.

But my understanding is that they can’t be recycled - yet. Given the
huge numbers of battery waste that I expect to be generated in the
future, I’m sure that we’ll get a solution in the not-to-distant future.
But that doesn’t help the OP.

---
- Mark

On 2018-09-10 04:13, Paul Dove wrote:

> I don’t see why not. Cut them open separate the copper foil from the
> aluminum and recycle them normally. You could just leave the graphene
> and lithium slurry on there.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Sep 9, 2018, at 4:16 PM, Mark Abramowitz via EV <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I agree with Marco.
>>
>> To my knowledge, squeezing out the rest of the life through energy
>> storage is really the only next useful stage for these batteries. The
>> y cannot be recycled.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Sep 9, 2018, at 6:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn
>>> cells in
>>> my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
>>>
>>> Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I
>>> did try
>>> to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were
>>> a
>>> nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
>>>
>>> If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety
>>> issues*
>>> having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged,
>>> for a
>>> couple years?
>>>
>>> Cell details
>>> 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two
>>> years)
>>> The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on
>>> them.  I
>>> estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
>>> www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Barry
>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>> <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20180909/9e4f6e87/attachment.html>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
>>> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
>>> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA
>>> (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>>
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Recycling: used LiOn CALB batteries

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
>find a way to dispose/donate/sell them<

https://www.batteryrecyclersofamerica.com/contact/

https://www.google.com/search?q=lithium+ion+batteries+recycle


% Yes, Virginia (or in this case, MarkA), li-ion batteries are recycled %




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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Re: Recycling: used LiOn CALB batteries

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Thank you, brucepd5!

Very good to hear.

I’ll be sure to spread the word where I see or hear misinformation on this.

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 10, 2018, at 12:21 PM, brucedp5 via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:

>> find a way to dispose/donate/sell them<
>
> https://www.batteryrecyclersofamerica.com/contact/
>
> https://www.google.com/search?q=lithium+ion+batteries+recycle
>
>
> % Yes, Virginia (or in this case, MarkA), li-ion batteries are recycled %
>
>
>
>
> For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
> http://evdl.org/archive/
>
>
> {brucedp.neocities.org}
>
> --
> Sent from: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/
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>

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Re: Recycling: used LiOn CALB batteries

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In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
I talked with Battery Recyclers of America.  Their minimum battery pickup is 1000 Lb.  However, they do take all type of batteries if you have 1000 lb.

________________________________
From: EV <[hidden email]> on behalf of brucedp5 via EV <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2018 12:21 PM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: brucedp5
Subject: [EVDL] Recycling: used LiOn CALB batteries

>find a way to dispose/donate/sell them<

https://www.batteryrecyclersofamerica.com/contact/

https://www.google.com/search?q=lithium+ion+batteries+recycle


% Yes, Virginia (or in this case, MarkA), li-ion batteries are recycled %




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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Re: Recycling: used LiOn CALB batteries

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
(put your location in where I put NJ)


>Calb 180Ah cells<
https://www.google.com/search?q=Calb+180Ah+cells
gives

EV-Power | CALB CA180FI - Lithium Cell LiFePO4 (3.2V/180Ah) ...
https://www.google.com/search?q=LiFePO4+recycle+nj
 ***gives many links to explore, one is below ...


If it's Rechargeable, it's Recyclable - State of New Jersey
https://www.nj.gov/dep/dshw/recycling/batteries.pdf
it's Recyclable. To find the nearest retail location to recycle your
rechargeable batteries visit www.rbrc.org. To find a ... Lithium Ion
(Li-ion). • Nickel Zinc (Ni-Zn).

https://www.nj.gov/dep/dshw/recycling/batteries.pdf
To find the nearest retail location to  
recycle your rechargeable batteries visit
www.rbrc.org.
To find a county/municipal drop off for  
rechargeable batteries or learn how to
properly dispose of your button cell bat-
teries, contact your County listed below:
County                Phone                
Atlantic               609-272-6950              
Bergen               201-807-8696              
Burlington           609-499-5200          
Camden             856-858-5241            
Cape May
609-465-9026
Cumberland       856-825-3700      
Essex                 973-857-2350                
Gloucester          856-478-6045          
Hudson               800-540-0987              
Hunterdon          908-788-1110          
Mercer                609-278-8086                
Middlesex           732-745-4170          
Monmouth          732-922-2234          
Morris                 973-829-8006                
Ocean                732-506-5047                
Passaic              973-305-5738              
Salem                 856-935-7900                
Somerset            908-231-7681            
Sussex               973-579-6998              
Union                  908-654-9890                  
Warren               908-453-2174              

WHAT TYPES OF BATTERIES
SHOULD I RECYCLE?
Recycle all Rechargeable Batteries.  
... Lithium Ion (Li-ion)  


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Re: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

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In reply to this post by Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Are these cells still available? How big is each cell physically?

I have an inverter charger that can handle lithium...and needs batteries.

Any idea on what their capacity looked like when you took them out of the
vehicle? Asked differently...how was your range at the end vs when newly
installed in the car?

-hk


On Sun, Sep 9, 2018, 16:06 Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Marco,
>
> Thanks for the suggestion.  We actually have solar with battery backup
> (FLA).  I've thought about adding them to our system.  Unfortunately we
> have an older charge inverter that doesn't support LiOn charging.  I
> probably could could find a way to wire the current BMS and batteries into
> the system.  More of a project time issue.
>
> If we had TOU I definitely would just charge them off the grid and
> arbitrage as you suggest.  No TOU in PA.
>
> Barry
>
> On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 4:58 PM, Ing. Marco Gaxiola <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> >      Why don’t you use them to build your own home energy storage system
> > at home? You can build a 48v system (3P-16Series of your CALBs) you would
> > have 180Ah x 3. Couldn’t those cells still have at least 30% capacity
> left,
> > Maybe more? But enough to power your home for half a day on basic
> > appliances like lamps, internet and TVs.
> >
> >       If you want to go pro, you could use the VFXR series from Outback
> > Power (http://www.outbackpower.com/products/inverter-chargers/
> > fxr-vfxr-series) which is a 120/240 since wave inverter grid tie and
> > island capable, and have the ability to charge from the grid/solar, buy
> and
> > sell electricity depending on your rates from day/night and power your
> > house in a black out event.
> >
> >       At least that’s what I’d like to do on my next opportunity.
> >
> > Marco Gaxiola
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Sep 9, 2018, at 9:09 AM, Barry Oppenheim via EV <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > I recently took my Saturn Vue EV out of service and have 48 LiOn cells in
> > my garage.  I am trying to find a way to *dispose/donate/sell them*.
> >
> > Does anyone know if *regular metal/battery recyclers* take them?  I did
> try
> > to give them to someone but the cross country shipping logistics were a
> > nightmare. I live halfway between Philly and NYC.
> >
> > If I decide to keep them does anyone see any problems or *safety issues*
> > having them sit in a heated garage, partially to mostly discharged, for a
> > couple years?
> >
> > Cell details
> > 48 Calb 180Ah cells (they have not been charged for at least two years)
> > The cells were put into service in 2011 and have ~30000 miles on them.  I
> > estimate ~500-600 partial charge/discharge cycles.
> > www.justanotherevconversion.blogspot.com
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Barry
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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> > attachments/20180909/9e4f6e87/attachment.html>
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> > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
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> > group/NEDRA)
> >
> >
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Fwd: What to do with used LiOn CALB batteries?

Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
Thanks to everyone for their advice and input on the Lithium recycling and
re-use.  Lot of good ideas out there.  Special thanks to Bruce for the
extensive recycling research.

There was so much interest from the group in "recycling" them for other
projects (EV and stationary backup).  Since so many people contacted me I
decided give them to the first person who reached out (Bill B).  If that
falls through I'll be sure to contact others who were interested.

Thanks again!
Barry
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